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Like to call this meeting of the Board of Zoning Appeals to order. 00:00:07
I'm Bridget. Have the Freedom of Information Act requirements been met? 00:00:10
Thank you. 00:00:14
Announcements before we start. If you have a cell phone, take it out. 00:00:16
And put it on silent. 00:00:21
Or turn it off. 00:00:23
Also, there is no crosstalk. 00:00:28
This is a quasi judicial hearing. It is being recorded. 00:00:31
And it is appealable, the decisions and so. 00:00:35
All comments. When you make comments during public comment, you're making them. 00:00:39
To the board. 00:00:44
You are not asking questions of any of the applicants. 00:00:45
Hope everybody understands that. 00:00:49
I will gavel you out of order if you cross talk. 00:00:52
So. 00:00:55
Now ask for approval of the minutes from the May 8th meeting. 00:00:57
Have. I don't think there were any comments or changes. 00:01:01
OK. Do I hear a motion for approval? 00:01:05
Much different than that James made the motion. 00:01:08
2nd. 00:01:13
All in favor signify by saying aye. 00:01:14
Like sign opposed, the minutes are approved. 00:01:16
The first item. 00:01:18
Oh my. 00:01:21
The first item is a variance request 12 by 4 middle St. 00:01:23
Any favor architects? 00:01:28
Variances from 2120 C 3A to allow two buildings on one lot. 2125 B to increase the principal building coverage on the lot. 00:01:30
Beyond the maximum allowable 2126 B to allow the impervious coverage beyond the maximum. 00:01:37
2127 B to increase the principal building square footage beyond the maximum allowable and 2123 F. 00:01:43
And 2122 C one and three to reduce the required side yard set back and eliminate the side facade requirements. 00:01:49
To replace the existing parish hall on the Stella Marist Church campus in accordance with Zoning Ordinance 21179. 00:01:57
Charles, will you please present for the town? 00:02:03
Yes, thank you, Madam Chair. 00:02:05
Good afternoon, board members. 00:02:08
And public. 00:02:11
Thanks for being here. 00:02:12
As Madam Chair stated, this is a request for variances. 00:02:15
For 1204 Middle St. 00:02:19
Here is the location of the property. 00:02:22
Along the corner of Osceola Middle and Station 12. 00:02:26
This is the existing parish hall. 00:02:30
The background and the. 00:02:33
Parish offices building up front. 00:02:35
And the church is located on the other side of Station 12. 00:02:38
Orientation. 00:02:41
Here's the posting on the property advertising this evening's meeting. 00:02:44
And here are a few. 00:02:48
Photographs of the property. 00:02:50
This is back at the. 00:02:52
Back corner next to the adjacent residential property. 00:02:54
This is the front facade of the parish hall. 00:02:59
The side facade along Station 12. 00:03:02
Another shot of the front facade from the rear of the. 00:03:06
Irish offices and then. 00:03:09
Looking across the asphalt parking lot behind the church. 00:03:11
There's the church and the. 00:03:15
Parasol Here's an aerial shot of the Parish Hollow. 00:03:18
Right here in the middle of the screen. 00:03:23
And then this is from the. 00:03:26
County's parcel map. 00:03:29
And you can see where this. 00:03:30
Building sits on this lot pretty. 00:03:32
Tightly up against the side to side property line and near the rear property line. 00:03:36
This is the existing site plan. 00:03:45
Property that. 00:03:48
Talking about Tonight is highlighted in yellow. 00:03:50
That's the existing building. 00:03:54
And then this is the proposed building right here. 00:03:56
When we look at side by side from. 00:04:04
Last month. This is what was proposed in March. Here's the proposal. 00:04:07
Through June. 00:04:12
This is slightly smaller building. 00:04:14
Speaking of that size change, it's. 00:04:23
Little over 1000 feet less than the proposal from last month. 00:04:26
Which makes it just under. 00:04:32
Just over 4750 square feet larger than the. 00:04:36
Existing parish hall. 00:04:40
And. 00:04:43
Make this bigger for y'all. 00:04:44
Some notable pieces of this. 00:04:48
Are that? 00:04:51
You know, there there's a number of places where the building would be a little bit bigger. 00:04:53
The kitchen would grow by about 150 square feet. 00:04:59
Bathroom space would increase by about 500 square feet. 00:05:03
The existing library and conference room. 00:05:08
This is the. 00:05:12
Sorry, I should probably should have mentioned that this is the existing floor plan of the first floor right here. This is the 00:05:13
proposed floor plan of the first floor down here. 00:05:18
Currently this is the library and conference room. 00:05:24
Which is about 360 square feet. 00:05:27
And the proposed conference room. 00:05:30
Would be this yellow building yellow space here? 00:05:33
And then this would be the library. 00:05:37
Next to it and. 00:05:39
Total of 830 square feet. 00:05:41
So much more. 00:05:45
Conference room space, The actual. 00:05:47
Call it the. 00:05:52
What would you the congregation room? Yeah, the. 00:05:57
Where the? 00:06:01
Telecasting of the masses occurs is. 00:06:03
Going to increase by about 100. 00:06:06
50 square feet. It's not a big increase. 00:06:09
From what exists today to what is proposed down here. 00:06:12
The driving force for the increase in square footage. 00:06:16
It turns out is. 00:06:20
Circulation. 00:06:22
So if you look at the existing building, it has one. 00:06:25
23 points of access to it and it has these narrow hallways. 00:06:29
And classrooms that come off of. 00:06:34
The main built main room. 00:06:37
With no egress to the outdoors. 00:06:39
The proposed building would have 1/2. 00:06:42
3/4. 00:06:46
5. 00:06:48
I want to say there. 00:06:51
7 But I'm only counting five points of the egress. 00:06:52
But the. 00:06:57
Square footage of this space. The width of these corridors is. 00:06:59
Increases the. 00:07:03
Circulation space in the building from about 800 square feet to. 00:07:06
Almost 3700 square feet. 00:07:10
That's the bulk of the increase in square footages for safety reasons and accessibility. 00:07:13
Then similarly, this is the second floor floor plan. 00:07:22
Also has better circulation. There's also an elevator. 00:07:28
Proposed to access this space, which is currently unavailable. 00:07:31
Umm, kind of. 00:07:39
Speaking to safety, the existing parish hall lacks a sprinkler system, which would be required in the new building. 00:07:40
And then? 00:07:50
Moving on. 00:07:52
They're they're requesting variances from several sections of the ordinance. 00:07:53
This is in the religious institution requirements that there be 1 building on the lot and that meet the set back and lot 00:07:59
coverages. 00:08:03
These are existing nonconformities that. 00:08:07
Are present today. 00:08:11
And would be present in the new building, so. 00:08:13
Requesting A variance to make that a conforming situation there. 00:08:16
And then for the side yard. 00:08:20
Setbacks. These are also. 00:08:23
From the ground level, these are existing nonconformities. The current building sits. 00:08:27
About 8 feet off of that side property line. 00:08:32
The new building would be pulled back further to be at least 10 feet, which is a minimum allowed in our ordinance so. 00:08:36
While it still requires A variance from the 15 foot. 00:08:43
It would be. 00:08:47
Within the realm of what is allowed currently, the building is in a place where it wouldn't be allowed to be located. 00:08:48
At 7 1/2 to 8 feet from the property line. 00:08:56
Then the ground floor articulations. 00:08:59
The current building has no articulations on the side. 00:09:04
This building would have an articulation that would still. 00:09:07
Not meet our 38 foot length. 00:09:11
What is being proposed is not a single family home. 00:09:14
So this. 00:09:18
Certainly makes some sense that this wouldn't be a. 00:09:19
Facet of the design for a. 00:09:24
Congregation hall versus these ordinances that are written for single family development. 00:09:27
And the second floor elements. 00:09:33
Current building has a second floor that's all within the roof lines of the of the building. 00:09:36
This proposed building would have a second floor that is. 00:09:42
Set along that side property line nearest to the Fort. 00:09:46
Moultrie Visitor Center. 00:09:50
And it would exceed the 32 feet without articulation, so that's the reason for the variance there. 00:09:52
And then? 00:10:00
The requirement that there only be a 32 linear feet of. 00:10:02
Facade within the 15 foot set back. 00:10:07
Would not be met by. This building is not currently met either, so this would be. 00:10:11
Further, umm. 00:10:15
Removal of the existing nonconformity to make it a. 00:10:18
Conformity by variance. 00:10:22
And then the again with the second floor element subject to a second. 00:10:25
A secondary set back. 00:10:29
Current current situation does not have a second floor that needs to be set back, it's set inside the roof. 00:10:31
That's they're proposing A2 story. 00:10:38
Side to side along the side of the Fort. 00:10:41
So that's the reason for this variance request. 00:10:45
Moving on to the principal building coverage area. 00:10:48
The current coverage on the lot is. 00:10:52
In excess of what is allowed. 00:10:58
And the new? 00:11:00
Proposal would increase that slightly. 00:11:02
On the impervious coverage. 00:11:09
Current coverage on the lots that. 00:11:11
Say 51%. 00:11:14
And the impervious coverage being proposed would reduce that to 46%. 00:11:16
Which is above the 30% that is allowed by ordinance. 00:11:21
And then for principal building square footage. 00:11:26
Maximum building is allowed to be 5600 square feet. The current building on the lot is. 00:11:30
About 12,700 square feet and the. 00:11:36
New building that's being proposed. 00:11:39
It was around 18,500 last month and they've reduced it to about 17,500 this month so. 00:11:42
Still 4700 feet larger, but as I discussed earlier. 00:11:51
Great portion, almost 40% of that is for circulation and improves. 00:11:56
Public safety. 00:12:01
So there's the principal building square footage. 00:12:04
When when the board. 00:12:08
Reviewing variants there for hardship tests that. 00:12:10
Need to be found to be in place for the granting of a variance. 00:12:14
One being. 00:12:20
Extraordinary exceptional conditions pertaining to the particular piece of property. 00:12:22
The fact that this is a religious institution and it's been. 00:12:27
Used as such for. 00:12:32
Sometimes is an extraordinary exceptional condition in the area. 00:12:34
It's unique to this property. 00:12:40
These conditions do not generally apply to other properties in the vicinity. That's the only church par. 00:12:44
Parcels in the area. 00:12:50
These conditions, the application of the ordinance to the particular property, would effectively prohibit or unreasonably restrict 00:12:55
the utilization. 00:12:58
Without the variances, the existing parish hall would continue to deteriorate because it. 00:13:03
Couldn't be replaced. 00:13:09
And there would be. 00:13:11
It would maintain its lack of modern accessibility and safety. 00:13:13
And would continue to be a non conforming structure in the Rs district. 00:13:17
The authorization of a variance will not be of substantial detriment to adjacent property or the public good, and the character of 00:13:23
the district will not be harmed by the granting of the variance. 00:13:28
The proposal would enhance the visual appeal of the property. 00:13:35
Would improve on nonconformities that detract from neighborhood compatibility. 00:13:39
And would improve the handling of storm water on the property to the benefit of all neighboring properties. 00:13:43
As such, staff is recommending approval of the variances requested to enable the redevelopment of the Parish hall. 00:13:49
The improvements in the non conforming setbacks. 00:13:58
And impervious coverage will enhance neighborhood compatibility. 00:14:01
And increased massing. 00:14:05
And coverage are countered by the massing's location closer to the adjacent commercial governmental use bill at the Fort Moultrie 00:14:08
Visitor Center. 00:14:12
And the enhanced circulation patterns in the building. 00:14:17
Promoting accessibility and public safety. 00:14:20
An increase in. 00:14:23
Principal building coverage and square footage are both offset by the important reduction in impervious coverage which will allow. 00:14:26
The larger building to better address stormwater concerns in the area. 00:14:33
Than the existing smaller building. 00:14:37
With its asphalt parking lot currently due. 00:14:39
The Board should consider these recommendations in accordance with the standards of Section 21179 of the zoning ordinance. 00:14:42
Thank you, Charles. 00:14:49
You have any questions of Charles? 00:14:51
OK. Eddie, would you like to present for the applicant? 00:14:59
Oh, oh, sorry. 00:15:12
There we go. 00:15:13
Good evening. My name is Eddie Faber with E Faber Architects. I am representing Monsignor McInerney. 00:15:19
His congregation and Catholic Diocese of Charleston I have with me. 00:15:24
Joel Trantham from my office. Michael Strobel. 00:15:27
And Jared Raskin Allah, who've been working on this project. 00:15:30
Diligently and appreciate it. 00:15:33
For the benefit of the of the Board members and the public that were not here at the prior presentation, we've got just a quick 00:15:36
summary. 00:15:40
And then? 00:15:43
Someone my team will present some more detailed facts and will present the current proposal. 00:15:45
So just just by way of introduction to those who weren't here last time. 00:15:49
The property owned by the diocese. 00:15:53
Circled in the red presently. 00:15:56
And at the last meeting, it was granted a special exception to be designated a religious institution, which is not uncommon for 00:15:59
many properties on the island. 00:16:03
The portion that we're Speaking of this evening is where the. 00:16:07
Proposed new hall would go and the Gray shaded area where the current existing hall. 00:16:10
Sits presently. 00:16:15
As Charles referenced, it backs up to. 00:16:17
The National Park. 00:16:20
And the whole intent of replacing the building that sits there. 00:16:22
Felt like obviously that that was the most neighborhood compatible solution to this. 00:16:26
And definitely improvement. 00:16:30
To the area, the building and. 00:16:33
Least effect with backing up to the. 00:16:36
The park building. 00:16:39
Just orientation photos that everybody's familiar with the area, obviously. 00:16:41
The Park Service buildings where the Old Navy Army hospital used to be. 00:16:45
The bottom left photo you can see the roof of the hall as it sits presently backing up to the asphalt parking lot of the Park 00:16:49
Service. 00:16:53
Another one illustrating that property as well. 00:17:00
These are general photos of the existing condition of the building. 00:17:04
The asphalt paving that is there, all of which will go away to pervious parking as we have spoken about previously. 00:17:08
Umm, current condition. 00:17:15
There are significant planted buffers, particularly along the backside of the park area. 00:17:19
On the buildings buffered by the historic building. 00:17:24
On the front of it and Middle St. as well. 00:17:27
Their buffer elements between the residential structure to the rear of the current hall. 00:17:29
Which would be remain, which would remain an enhanced as with those on the. 00:17:33
Rear section of the area where the parking area would be. 00:17:37
Just just quickly, this area has always been. 00:17:41
Had a historic designation, although it not our historic use, although not formally designated as such. 00:17:44
The general area had been located as and known as Birmingham Square since 1871. 00:17:49
Area photos of that time demonstrate the church. 00:17:59
Sitting where it sits presently. 00:18:03
Open space around it, which is something we sought to maintain from the get go. 00:18:06
And on the Sanborn maps to the left. 00:18:10
You can see where the church is and the fact of. 00:18:13
Of how many of those properties have changed, and our goal with the church property is that it remains as open as possible without 00:18:16
another structure. 00:18:20
On that section of the property. 00:18:24
Photograph historically. 00:18:28
Army Hospital used to be. 00:18:30
There right where the current visitor center is presently. 00:18:32
And it's not an uncommon thing. Again, I have, no pun intended, preaching to the choir that there's several religious institutions 00:18:37
here. 00:18:40
On the island. 00:18:44
Some of them have a formal designation, some don't. 00:18:45
I think all know. 00:18:48
So much on the island is just zoned. 00:18:50
Residential everything. 00:18:52
Short of some elements in the commercial district. 00:18:54
So it's no wonder that. 00:18:56
Many of these things do not apply. Much of the things that we're asking for is Charles reference are already existing non 00:18:58
conforming. 00:19:02
Uses of the existing structure and conditions that exist there presently. 00:19:05
We have similar things. 00:19:09
Sullivan's Island Baptist Church. 00:19:11
Church at the Holy Cross, which is just across the street from me. 00:19:13
Where I live and Sunrise Presbyterian Upright Beach Inlet. 00:19:16
We'll quickly run through the drawings as presented last time. Again, just a refresher for those that were not here. 00:19:22
The existing site plan as things sit presently. 00:19:27
With the parish hall in the dark Gray on the far right of the lot. 00:19:30
The current paved areas you can see. 00:19:34
They are behind the church and in between the church and the house that fronts Middle St. 00:19:37
Proposed. 00:19:43
Building as we had at that time. 00:19:45
And with the parking area to the rear, which again, although not a part of this application this evening, is something that would 00:19:47
be. 00:19:51
Sustainable has to accommodate all of the drainage, improve the conditions there. 00:19:54
All pervious pavers buffers, so something that was. 00:19:58
Very thoughtfully located in a way that doesn't impact. 00:20:02
That area negatively, it improves it. 00:20:05
And maintaining a green band. 00:20:08
Of residential. 00:20:11
Yard, for lack of a better word, all along Osceola and Middle St. rather than parking backed up to the church. 00:20:13
As it is presently. 00:20:18
At that time we showed. 00:20:20
Some rough renderings of your approach as you come down the island and down Middle St. and turn on Osceola. 00:20:22
With the proposed structure. 00:20:28
Behind it at the new hall. 00:20:30
Again. 00:20:32
With the deliberate intent of this being a background building, the church and the historic structures forward of it are the ones 00:20:33
that. 00:20:36
Set the tone and the ones that. 00:20:39
Have the attention here. 00:20:41
At that time also. 00:20:45
Illustrated. 00:20:46
Current Hall and. 00:20:48
How those compare to? 00:20:50
What the proposed hall would be the Gray and blue elements. 00:20:53
Overlaid on the building or the things that are presently on the site versus what would be there with a proposed new plan? 00:20:56
One thing again that was a bit unfortunate, was there some? 00:21:05
Letters that went out and and respectfully. I think it was just either misunderstanding and misinformation. 00:21:11
So we just felt it was important to address a lot of that and we've done so in this presentation and with neighbors that we've met 00:21:16
in neighborhood meetings that we've had. 00:21:20
And one of them was saying that it would have adverse consequences for the proposed construction would for the neighborhood. 00:21:25
But the proposed building, as we said, is. 00:21:32
Isolated to the one that abuts the commercial and institution for Moultrie Lock. 00:21:34
And as Father McInerney has referenced, he said. 00:21:39
Several of the neighbors immediately around there, all of whom we've spoken to when you showed you in a graphic. 00:21:42
Are in full support of the proposal as it stands. 00:21:46
That is demonstrated by this, and this is where we started at the last meeting. 00:21:50
So all of the properties. 00:21:55
That have checkmarks on them. 00:21:58
Are adjacent to what is now the religious designated property. 00:22:00
Of the church. 00:22:04
The Blue Square rectangle there is where the new hall would be. 00:22:06
But at the last meeting too, we were then asked to. 00:22:10
Expand that. 00:22:15
Outrage to people beyond who may not have been spoken to. 00:22:17
We offered up a meeting and some other things. I'll let Michael speak to that. 00:22:21
Yeah, so Michael Stroppel with the EFAV architects as well. 00:22:28
So coming out of the meeting on May 8th last month, there were kind of four takeaways that we had. The first one was obviously to 00:22:31
come back in 30 days, which here we are. 00:22:35
The second one was to create a comparison of the existing building, and we ended up doing a deep dive analysis of that existing 00:22:40
building, which we'll show in just a minute. 00:22:44
The third one was to meet with further neighbors kind of beyond the immediate vicinity of our site, which we did. We had a 00:22:49
neighborhood meeting as well that we'll get into in this presentation. 00:22:53
And asked if there was any ability to reduce the square footage of the building even slightly, which we did reduce the square 00:22:59
footage by over 1000 square feet. 00:23:02
So jumping in to the analysis of the existing building, again, this is not something we would typically do for a building that's 00:23:07
planning on being demolished. 00:23:11
But we've had a lot of questions from neighbors and from the board last time about how does this new building compare to the 00:23:16
existing building? 00:23:19
So we wanted to make sure that we could answer all those questions completely accurately. 00:23:23
And so again, one question that's come up multiple times in the neighbor meeting and at the at the previous board. 00:23:28
Was, you know, why can't we just use the existing footprint? Why can't we use essentially the same size building all of those 00:23:35
things? 00:23:38
And so when we jumped into comparing that existing building. 00:23:42
Again, just looking at the variances that would be required today to build that existing building. 00:23:45
All five of the variances that we're requesting today would still be required to build that existing building. 00:23:50
Many of which we've improved upon. I think all of them except for the square footage number. 00:23:56
And we would be required to request 1/6 variance to build that existing building. 00:24:01
Which would be a request for a variance for. 00:24:05
Set back. 00:24:09
Which would affect? 00:24:10
Negatively affect the only residential neighbor that's up against this property, so we're pulling our new proposed hall further 00:24:11
away. 00:24:15
And respecting our only residential neighbor more than what the what the existing proposal does. 00:24:18
And then the other thing that got brought up and there was a question at the last meeting that. 00:24:25
What is the occupancy of the new building? 00:24:31
And we gave an answer that referenced the code required occupancy, but I think there was a little bit of misunderstanding. 00:24:33
There is a code requirement. 00:24:40
In the International Building Code that gets into. 00:24:42
A calculation that essentially levels the playing field of all different commercial buildings with different uses. 00:24:45
You've got assembly uses like what we have, you've got office uses, you've got residential uses, mercantile uses. 00:24:52
All of those things. 00:24:57
And it is a calculation. 00:24:59
That gives us a number that helps us to size our safety equipment and our egress. 00:25:01
And so that number. 00:25:06
Tells us. 00:25:08
That is again a calculation that comes from the code. What it doesn't say is this is how many people we plan on having in this 00:25:09
building. 00:25:13
Which I think there was a misunderstanding there. 00:25:17
And So what we did was. 00:25:19
We did an analysis, a code analysis on the existing hall. 00:25:21
Versus the new home? 00:25:25
So again, we threw out a number of 600 at the last meeting, which was pretty close to. 00:25:26
Where we landed. 00:25:31
But when we look at the existing building, the existing hall. 00:25:32
From a code requirement standpoint, would hold 580 people. 00:25:35
We've also in the works of demolishing the Shamrock House next door, which is an education facility that's being incorporated into 00:25:39
this building. 00:25:42
So if you take those 38 occupants. 00:25:46
The campus overall is going from 618 occupants to 627. That's an increase of nine. 00:25:48
So I think what the question was really asking was. 00:25:56
What is the size of this congregating room in comparison to what it was before? And is this going to be a significantly larger 00:25:59
congregating room that's going to allow the congregation to grow? 00:26:05
The answer is no. 00:26:10
And I think Charles mentioned that in his. 00:26:12
His presentation as well. 00:26:14
So we did an overlay again of the existing size of the congregating room, which is the red dashed line. 00:26:16
Versus the proposed size of the congregating room, which is the yellow. 00:26:22
Shaded rectangle and we've got a scale figure in there just to show. 00:26:26
It increases by three to four feet on each side. It's about the width of one person on each side. 00:26:30
So the actual number of people that will come into this building. 00:26:36
Are not significantly different than what is there today. 00:26:40
So I guess the next question is, if that is the case, why is our building 4700 square feet bigger? 00:26:44
And there's a lot of code implications and requirements. 00:26:51
And I'm going to let Joel kind of jump into the details of that, but there I think Charles hit on it a little bit. 00:26:54
As well. 00:26:59
My name is Joel Trantham. I'm also an architect with the Eva architects here. And I would like to thank Charles for giving the 00:27:03
extensive breakdown that you did. 00:27:07
And running through all those numbers, we. 00:27:11
Looking at laying those out and how to explain that best and and. 00:27:13
Instead of rattling off a bunch of numbers, we. 00:27:17
Put together this graphic. 00:27:21
Looking on the left side is the existing plan. It's the first floor on the top and it's the second floor on the bottom. 00:27:23
Compared to our proposed plan at the same scale. 00:27:29
1st floor on the top, second floor on the bottom. 00:27:32
The space that's highlighted in Gray. 00:27:34
Is our circulation, Circulation and support space. 00:27:37
This is 84% of the requested increase, which is a significant portion. 00:27:40
We in between the last meeting this we're able to tighten up that space sum. 00:27:47
But the reason why we can't fully. 00:27:51
Get rid of that space is because what that includes. 00:27:54
Are the handicap accessibility requirements, there are certain sizing, spacing, turnabouts that we have to do? 00:27:58
There's life safety requirements, There's pump rooms, riser rooms, enunciator control panels. 00:28:05
There's code compliance stairs and elevators. Those are not in the existing structure. 00:28:11
There's code required, bathrooms that require turnabout radiuses on either side in order to also meet egress, and fixtures that 00:28:16
are calculated that don't certainly meet code. 00:28:20
Right now. 00:28:24
New buildings have it and utility rooms in which we have to incorporate things and there's also code required walkways. You're not 00:28:25
allowed under the building code to walk through 1 space into another space that's there because people have died in buildings and. 00:28:33
These code and life safety items are always instituted into the code. 00:28:40
So that we can produce the safest buildings we can. 00:28:44
Another item that was brought up at the meeting is that this was going to be the largest building on Sullivan's Island. It was 00:28:50
difficult. 00:28:53
At that time to directly address that. 00:28:57
But we've gone and done an exhaustive analysis of all the buildings on Sullivan's Island so that we can present that adequately to 00:29:00
you. 00:29:03
This is a diagram showing the building that we're in right now. That's the building labeled 2 on this diagram. 00:29:08
We went to the website for Creech and Associates and interestingly enough it calls it out as 18,000 square feet. 00:29:14
Our building is 17,500. It's also fully elevated, one story and our building is not. 00:29:20
There's a pink building across the street which is 2056 Myrtle. 00:29:26
It has an 18,000 square foot envelope which most people probably passed as they walked into here. 00:29:30
Since it's turned perpendicular to the street and lengthwise is buffered on either side, it doesn't present a large facade. 00:29:35
That's an organizational element we're instituting in our building. 00:29:42
There's also. 00:29:46
Building out the back, which doesn't have any articulations, but it's a 24,000 square foot building, that's not what we're 00:29:47
proposing. 00:29:50
As you can see on this diagram, we put our footprint for comparison there. 00:29:55
So there was a comparison made to the Sullivans Island Elementary School. 00:29:59
As you can see, this is the footprint of our building that we're proposing. 00:30:03
11,732 square feet. 00:30:07
This is the footprint of the Sullivans Island Elementary School. 00:30:12
It's six times larger footprint and a five times larger square footage. We just felt like it was. 00:30:15
Important to be accurate when we're comparing these structures. 00:30:20
When we look at parish campuses. 00:30:25
This is the size of our footprint. 00:30:27
This is the size of Holy Cross as parish campus. 00:30:31
I believe this campus clearly shows that with a thoughtful design strategy. 00:30:34
A larger Paris campus can Nestle neatly and contribute to neighborhood compatibility. 00:30:39
Which is one of the goals we are striving to achieve in this process. 00:30:44
We also met with neighbors. 00:30:48
And I'll let Eddie speak to that. 00:30:49
Thank you. 00:30:53
At the last meeting they just request to reach out wider and and. 00:30:55
Monsignor McInerney took it upon himself to send an e-mail out. 00:31:00
That was forwarded to others and others and others and everybody invited to the existing parish hall. 00:31:04
Just. 00:31:08
Hear this presentation and ask any questions that they may have. 00:31:09
And many showed up. 00:31:13
Most of the questions had to. 00:31:15
Do with traffic and concern related to that? 00:31:17
And our response tonight is as it was then. 00:31:21
That the goal with what we're doing with that sustainable parking area that is pushed to the rear of the lot. 00:31:26
As supported by all of those that are immediately adjacent and affected by it. 00:31:30
Is to pull some of the cars off the street that line the street during the masses. 00:31:35
Now that happens. 00:31:39
You know, once a week or doing feast days Sunday mornings. 00:31:41
And, and they were asked would they be willing to make concessions regarding to. 00:31:45
If you exit off Osceola not turning right, could you turn left? 00:31:50
All of those things, Monsignor, the church, everybody is absolutely open to. 00:31:53
The parking area would be gated and although that's not a part of this meeting or this this approval and I just feel like it needs 00:31:57
to be addressed. 00:32:00
We are certainly open to it, but it felt like we needed to be. 00:32:05
Perfectly straight up that all of that gets reviewed by South Carolina dot. 00:32:07
So they make the final call on it. 00:32:11
But we are open to all of those things as that proceeds through the process. 00:32:13
Going into our currently proposed. 00:32:19
Plan. As we said in the previous, nothing has changed in fact, that the hall would be located where the current one is, adjacent 00:32:22
to the National Park Park. 00:32:26
Parking lot. 00:32:30
The existing. 00:32:32
Hall, the proposed Hall and as we reference and as requested by the board last time, was there any way to. 00:32:33
Squeeze some square footage out. 00:32:39
Of it we did, we took 1000 square feet. 00:32:41
Out of the building. 00:32:44
Which made the footprint smaller. 00:32:45
And renderings that we had at that time of that approach. 00:32:49
Which are the same caliber that we did the first time. 00:32:52
But when you compare the two, you'll see that the building behind the historic house on the right. 00:32:56
Is smaller. 00:33:01
And our footprint. 00:33:03
Similarly, got smaller. 00:33:05
Again, all of the things that were referenced prior. 00:33:08
With related to. 00:33:12
Code required elements are not things that we can cut back on, and that's where the bulk of all of this increase comes from. 00:33:14
But regardless, still felt like this building. 00:33:20
Nestle's extremely well where it always has. 00:33:22
The other thing that as we move through design review board on this are very conscious of the fact that again. 00:33:26
This is, as I said, as a background building. We are not trying to steal the Thunder from the church or any of the historic 00:33:32
structures there. 00:33:34
It serves a purpose and a function. That doesn't mean that. 00:33:37
Cannot be well articulated and. 00:33:40
Steadily pick up on elements of larger structures on the island. 00:33:43
I hadn't referenced previously. 00:33:48
At least tonight's meeting. But the scale comparison up there gives. 00:33:50
Some sense of how this building? 00:33:54
Compares to other large structures that are just residential on the island. 00:33:56
And. 00:34:01
The way we would articulate it, too, would be with porches and recesses and things of that nature. 00:34:03
That allow it to have even more breathing room off the street than it does presently. 00:34:08
Most importantly to our neighbor to the rear that we were pulling back. 00:34:12
From where the building sits presently to give more room for buffer. 00:34:16
At a height that is lower than what's? 00:34:19
Allowable. 00:34:22
And would would potentially allow of you to return for our neighbor to the rear. 00:34:23
That is again just the overlays of the existing structures and the. 00:34:29
Current one the views of as it stands presently. 00:34:34
And we did a series of. 00:34:38
Enhanced renderings here that show what? 00:34:40
We think is. 00:34:43
Most important, particularly with the neighborhood compatibility issue. 00:34:44
Our existing view and a rendering showing the proposed view. 00:34:48
With the building tucked back to the rear of the historic house. 00:34:52
Church is still front and center. 00:34:55
Similarly here. 00:34:57
Another thing which is important which again. 00:34:59
Will fall to dot, but it is our intent that that lawn area forward of the house to the rear, the historic house to the rear. 00:35:01
Will be returned to the full turn so people don't cut that corner. It's a safety issue presently. It's something we would be 00:35:08
addressing as we move forward. 00:35:12
The proposed. 00:35:17
And down. 00:35:20
Station 12. 00:35:22
The existing and the proposed. 00:35:23
And that's our conceptual massing as we move forward with this. Needless to say, all of that gets developed as we move through. 00:35:25
Design Review board. 00:35:30
Again, I think it's important and respectfully to all our neighbors that we've spoken to that support or not. 00:35:33
Those that are most impacted by this is where we started and expanded our circle. 00:35:40
And and all of them. 00:35:45
Have voiced nothing but support for this project. 00:35:47
So we demonstrated and don't need to go through this in detail. I know there are other items after ours here and there are people 00:35:51
that want to speak. 00:35:55
That we are in compliance with all of the conditions that are set for the variance test. 00:35:59
You'll have copies of that in your application. 00:36:04
And most importantly, I think it's been said best that the variances that we're requesting here they already. 00:36:06
Are conditions that exist. 00:36:13
We just need them to continue the use here. They're not detrimental. They're instrumental to allow the parish to construct the 00:36:15
background building. 00:36:19
Besides that, existing institutional Port Moultrie Visitor Center, preserving the historic views and open space. 00:36:23
Surrounding the landmark sanctuary. 00:36:28
An adjacent landmark structures. 00:36:30
So not too much of A stretch that our views wouldn't change. 00:36:32
Too much from the perspective of the historic photo of Malone. 00:36:37
So happy to answer any questions. 00:36:41
I do. I have. 00:36:47
A couple questions. 00:36:50
So, Mr. Favour, how do you? 00:36:51
What would be your response to someone that says that? 00:36:56
The new structure. 00:37:00
It's a nonconformity. 00:37:01
Now yes, and 21-149 says that. 00:37:04
The extent, degree, size, and frequency of any nonconformity shall not, shall not be increased in any manner. How do I How do we? 00:37:09
Vote to allow what you're asking us to do and still. 00:37:17
Be hold true be compliance with 21-149. 00:37:21
Yes, Sir, I just think it's still. 00:37:26
Falls within those other conditions where it's an extraordinary condition here. 00:37:29
It's unique to this property has been historically. 00:37:33
And for us to. 00:37:35
Maintain that use even in a building as it sits presently. 00:37:37
We have to meet the code requirements regarding egress. 00:37:40
Elevators, all of those things which. 00:37:44
To do that in the existing envelope. 00:37:45
Would basically render the existing building useless. 00:37:48
So. 00:37:51
Current code issue. 00:37:53
That it plays a big part, yes. And why? 00:37:54
There is some increase in. 00:37:57
The continued or expansion of the nonconformities? Yes, Sir. 00:38:00
And then? 00:38:05
The traffic issue. 00:38:06
Seems to me to be sort of a big thing for folks and and I get it that. 00:38:08
The congregation isn't going to expand, so you're not going to have any more people coming on Sundays. 00:38:12
Guess I'm sorry. 00:38:18
You're not going to have any more folks coming to church on Sunday. 00:38:21
Once this is built versus. 00:38:26
This Sunday, that is. 00:38:28
The absolute intent and I'm happy to let someone from the church. 00:38:30
Speak to that, but it's almost a premise of theirs that it's not the intent to increase the congregation the. 00:38:33
Other issue though is. 00:38:41
So. 00:38:43
And maybe someone from the church has to speak to this. 00:38:44
It seems to me. 00:38:47
That folks are concerned about the traffic being more often. You're not going to expand your congregation, however. 00:38:48
When you have this facility completed, you're going to have more people coming on the island. 00:38:56
To do whatever it is that is. 00:39:00
Been undertaken at the at the new Parish Hall. 00:39:03
I would beg to differ. 00:39:07
Respectfully. 00:39:10
Because I think the same functions that happen now will just be better accommodated. But it's not that they happen more 00:39:11
frequently. They're more different. They they have set times and days that all of these things happen. 00:39:16
So if you had 100 people coming on Wednesday night, there'll still be 100 people coming on Wednesday night. Yes, Sir. 00:39:21
Yes, Sir. 00:39:27
Agreed, and I only bring this up here because I think it will be helpful as people speak. 00:39:29
And again, I know it's not. 00:39:33
Part of tonight, but it's part of what everybody wants to discuss a little bit. So for the record. 00:39:35
The traffic issue. 00:39:39
And I'll let the church speak to it. 00:39:41
All I can say is it's not their intent and the building. 00:39:43
Won't accommodate more people. 00:39:46
It accommodates, as we saw by the comparison, from a code standpoint. 00:39:48
Minimally more than what? 00:39:53
The current one does. 00:39:55
Parking and and I drive down there every Sunday morning and. 00:39:57
Saturday evenings with my dog in the golf court. Yes, they park on the side of the street. They're still gonna park on the side of 00:40:00
the street. I mean, I hate to say that, but the goal was to get some of that parking off of the street as much as we could. 00:40:06
And I have a lot of respect for our neighbors at the end of the island. 00:40:13
And and friends and clients that live down that way, but but. 00:40:17
I just again respectfully find it difficult to believe that. 00:40:21
Even with the current low that people drive all the way down to the. 00:40:25
Boat landing and come back and turn around or come back at her. We have totally agreed and said that. 00:40:29
With the permission of dot. 00:40:35
More than. 00:40:37
To have the egress. 00:40:38
Off of Osceola either be only an ingress, only a left turn, but we just don't have the ability to promise that to anybody. 00:40:40
So. 00:40:47
Yes, Sir. Yeah. Just as an FYI, in our approval of the special exception, we did say that dot would rule on ingress and egress 00:40:49
from the parking area. So. 00:40:53
That's in the engineers and the DOT's hand. 00:40:58
Mr. Elliott, would you like somebody from the church to address? Kind of. 00:41:02
Functions or what happens? 00:41:05
Yeah. OK. Wait a minute. OK, Sorry. 00:41:07
Yeah, yeah. So I think what we're gonna do if we see if we have any more questions of Eddie. 00:41:11
Do not. 00:41:18
Michael. 00:41:19
OK. 00:41:20
All right, we may. We, you know, when we start deliberating, we're probably going to ask you questions again. 00:41:21
All right, we have 25 people. 00:41:27
Signed up to speak. 00:41:31
So, umm. 00:41:32
What I'm going to do is I'm going to ask someone to speak for the church, if that's Father McInerney. 00:41:34
Then I will ask somebody that wants to speak against the variance. 00:41:40
And then we're going to do some voting because I do not want to be here until midnight, OK? We're going to do it just like we did 00:41:44
last time, so from McInerney. 00:41:49
My neighbor who has to get up to another meeting? Yes, go ahead. 00:41:54
You yield your time. 00:41:58
No, you have to go to the podium. 00:42:00
And you have to state your, your name and your address please. 00:42:02
Chris Young, 402 Station 12th St. on Sullivan's We live directly behind the. 00:42:07
Proposed new parish lived there for. 00:42:12
10 or 1211 years, we've obviously gotten known father. 00:42:15
Over the years, both. 00:42:19
Us putting up with them and probably them more putting up with us with just two children so. 00:42:21
We've met with their land planners, the architects they've been. 00:42:26
Super courteous and everything we've addressed we're probably the most. 00:42:31
Directed affected neighbor. 00:42:35
With the size and. 00:42:37
Shape of the building? Of course we have. 00:42:39
Some views of the ocean and um. 00:42:42
We couldn't be any more excited about the project. 00:42:46
Especially assuming. 00:42:49
We can get some. 00:42:52
Work with the dot, the traffic circulation. 00:42:53
Would be humongous because it's a disaster. 00:42:56
It's a disaster now it'll be a disaster. 00:42:59
Whether there's an old building or new building. So any relief on that? More parking the better on site, less parking off site. 00:43:02
I think with everybody else, my first question was to Eddie was like, whoa. 00:43:10
Is there gonna be another 200 people coming here? 00:43:14
And I'm fairly well knowledge in this business of development. 00:43:17
And once I dug into the plans. 00:43:21
Realized that the physical capacity. 00:43:24
You know, unless they started adding more classes on other days, which they obviously aren't. 00:43:28
The physical capacity of the building is only, you know, 5 to 10%, so. 00:43:33
Nothing that I think you would really feel. 00:43:37
Especially if you get the circulation of the parking but. 00:43:39
I know people have concerns of massing and. 00:43:43
I mean, I think it looks incredible. So I think. 00:43:46
Current situation is a real bad eyesore. 00:43:49
So I'm super excited about the project, happy to be a. 00:43:53
Supporter and and I believe with my neighbors we've talked as well in our street and. 00:43:57
And everybody's pretty excited, so just wanted to express that as being the direct neighbor and, um. 00:44:01
And just thanks for I really appreciate their time. They put a lot of time. 00:44:06
A lot of interest addressing all of our little nitpicky concerns. So just want to say that thank you, Paula McInerney. 00:44:11
You're up. 00:44:17
You want to wait. 00:44:20
OK, till the end. OK Would anyone like to speak against the variance? OK. 00:44:22
Go ahead, your name and address please. 00:44:26
Yeah. 00:44:29
My name is Neil Garfinkel. I live at 1001 Middle St. 00:44:31
Born in Charleston and coming to Sullivans my entire life. 00:44:36
And was fortunate enough to be able to buy a place here in 2011. Lived here as my primary residence since. 00:44:38
For me, this is about balancing the desire for development. 00:44:45
Church in excess of the current zoning regulations. 00:44:47
And this particularly in light of the existing size of the non conforming parish hall with the zoning codes overall objected to 00:44:51
preserve scale. 00:44:55
Limit congestion Congestion in residential neighborhoods for the benefit. 00:44:58
Town residents. 00:45:02
And to me, if the church wants to demolish the current parish, I'll improve the site. 00:45:04
And build a new hole that matches the old one plus whatever code. 00:45:08
Requirements are to bring up the code. 00:45:12
I think everyone would be highly supportive. 00:45:14
Even though the existing structure is already twice as large as you could, more than twice as large as you can build if you 00:45:17
started from scratch today without a variance. 00:45:20
But what they proposed is, you know, obviously something that's a bit more than that. 00:45:26
It's 40% larger, some of that. 00:45:30
Is code and Mr. Father. 00:45:33
And some of that is? 00:45:35
As you say circulation, which isn't technically code, but it's it it helps with. 00:45:36
Pulling the building. So if you took the 12,700 added code, I don't know what that would be, but it'd be something less. 00:45:40
Than the than what you proposed. 00:45:46
And it to me. 00:45:49
I understand that there's. 00:45:51
I in fact had a very simple conversation with the father about this, that there is no intent. 00:45:53
To have more people come or have the congregation get larger. But it is somewhat common sensical that if the building is larger. 00:45:59
If there are more classrooms and there are better classrooms. 00:46:05
That that may overtime result in more activities. 00:46:08
At the church and again, perhaps even a slight increase in attendance. 00:46:12
And that leads to traffic and congestion. 00:46:17
For every resident West of the church. And I understand Mr. Young is a neighbor. I don't really I understand why he doesn't have 00:46:19
objections. 00:46:23
But every single person that lives. 00:46:26
Past the church has to pass that intersection. 00:46:28
In order to get to their house, there is no bypass. It's not like the other churches. 00:46:31
On the arm where you can take Jasper, you can take middle. 00:46:34
There's only one way past and it's on Osceola or it's on Middle and the intersection of Station 12 and. 00:46:37
It just is a fact that you know the that is a choke point, particularly with beach traffic and boat traffic and the addition of 00:46:42
church traffic is a contributor. 00:46:46
To congestion getting past that point. 00:46:50
And I and you know, I just can't understand why the the board would allow a larger structure other than for code to be built. 00:46:53
Because the impact on all the residents West of the. 00:47:01
Church. 00:47:04
Is neutral to negative. 00:47:05
With traffic. 00:47:07
The zoning code, as you pointed out, Mr. Lee, clearly has a bias against the expansion of existing nonconformities. 00:47:09
And the threshold of ovarians is that you have to show that the existing code. 00:47:15
Results in a unreasonable. 00:47:21
Restriction of the utilization of the property and. 00:47:23
In my opinion, it's hard to meet that in that case. 00:47:26
Given the size of the existing parish hall with code additions. 00:47:29
And the successful operation if not perfect operation. 00:47:33
Of the Church for decades in its current footprint. 00:47:36
In my opinion, limiting the new parish hall to the existing square footage plus any code requirements that would need to be added. 00:47:40
Is a fair outcome because it would balance the desire of the church and its congregation to improve and modernize its aging 00:47:46
building, again primarily for the benefit of mostly non residents. 00:47:51
With the desires of residents to preserve the character peace and quiet. 00:47:57
Traffic included. 00:48:00
Of the western end of Sullivan's Island. 00:48:02
And to the extent that the board has a different view and approves. 00:48:04
The building as proposed. 00:48:08
I would. 00:48:11
Urged them to put on at least have a couple conditions around the use of the property. One is it. 00:48:12
That the church does. 00:48:16
And Father McInerney did discuss this at the. 00:48:18
Church employee traffic control people on busy Sundays or busy holidays to help with whatever that flow is, because it will be 00:48:21
different. 00:48:24
And secondly, I do have a concern that although. 00:48:29
Today, there is no weekday school at the church at the parish hall. 00:48:32
And I know that there's the school of Christ our King in Mount Pleasant. 00:48:37
And Father McInerney has told me that there's no plans to make this a school. And I take him in his word. But people and plans 00:48:40
change. 00:48:43
And. 00:48:47
If the Christ our King gets overcrowded. 00:48:48
And there's a building that's much larger, 40% larger under the current. 00:48:50
Proposal that that's something. 00:48:55
That the Church might consider. 00:48:57
Finally, I was hoping. I don't know whether there are parishioners. 00:49:00
On the on the board, but I would hope that if there are, they would recuse themselves. 00:49:04
From obviously from from this vote. 00:49:10
Can you state your first contingency again because I didn't follow what you traffic traffic control personnel like the traffic 00:49:12
control other churches and institutions and on busy days. 00:49:17
They have people out there to help. Coming out of a parking lot, have them turn left, turn right. 00:49:22
It's a free for all. 00:49:26
Currently and if that parking lot is bigger and there are more people. 00:49:27
It would be very helpful for, I think, everyone who lives down there to have the church help with an orderly. 00:49:32
Departure. 00:49:38
Of folks getting back to their. 00:49:39
Activities on the weekend? OK, on one of your points they would not be allowed to have a school. 00:49:41
At the church because schools. 00:49:49
On K5 through 12 are not allowed. 00:49:52
In our zoning ordinance, you can only have a Sunday school preschool, or you can have a preschool or a K5. 00:49:57
Is the only school certified that's allowed on this island is Sullivans Island Elementary? So they cannot expand and have a 00:50:05
school. 00:50:08
So no K through no K through 12. School is 3 for example. 00:50:12
No. 00:50:17
OK, only only certified preschools which is. 00:50:19
One to K5. 00:50:24
Which is. 00:50:26
I am a member of Church of the Holy Cross. I work in that 38,000 square foot building on Middle St. 00:50:27
We have a preschool. 00:50:33
Stops at K5. You cannot have a a certified school on Sullivans Island. It's in other in another area. 00:50:35
Excuse me, of the zoning ordinance. 00:50:42
Disabuse yourselves of that notion entirely. They cannot have a school. 00:50:43
OK. Thank you very much and thanks for your time. 00:50:47
You're welcome. 00:50:50
Now what I would like to do. 00:50:52
Is I'm going to ask. 00:50:55
That you limit those of you who want to speak. Unless you have a specific issue that you want to address, I'm going to ask you to 00:50:58
keep it under 30 seconds. 00:51:03
And um. 00:51:09
So how many of you want to speak with those conditions? 00:51:10
30 seconds. Do you see how many people are in the room? We have three other items on our agenda tonight. 00:51:17
So. 00:51:23
I don't want to hear the same thing over and over and over because what we're going to do is we're going to take a vote at the end 00:51:24
and say who agrees with what, right? And we will get a sense of that. Of course, we actually make our decisions based on the 00:51:28
zoning ordinance, so. 00:51:33
Not public opinion. 00:51:38
All right. 00:51:39
The gentleman in the back you. 00:51:42
We're going to go back and forth on for and against if we can. 00:51:44
Name. Address. 00:51:49
Make it clear I'm 4. I'm Larry Kabrowski. I live at 402 Sea Breeze Lane. 00:51:52
I lived there for. 00:51:58
Since 1981 I think. 00:51:59
I'm not a member of Stella Marist, but I think it's the best thing. It defines our. 00:52:01
Part of the island is the most beautiful. 00:52:05
Building on our island and everybody in this room. 00:52:07
And everybody who's against it. 00:52:11
They moved here and the church was here first. 00:52:13
And I've seen the parking and I've heard the arguments. 00:52:16
And it strikes me. 00:52:19
Almost in disbelief 99. 00:52:21
Percent of waking hours, there's no traffic there. 00:52:24
Is this maybe Wednesday night and Sunday morning? 00:52:27
The people that come to church, I can't think of better people to have there. We love having them there. 00:52:33
The traffic, the building. 00:52:39
Is big now, it'll be big later. It'll have very little, if any effect on us as neighbors. 00:52:42
But it would have a tremendous impact. 00:52:47
On the people that go to the church there in the facility. So if you weigh the things. 00:52:50
Most of our life there's like diligent and quiet. 00:52:54
And there's no traffic almost any of the time. 00:52:57
In this for a couple hours in a Sunday. 00:53:00
And maybe once a week I just find that. 00:53:03
This belief that people would find that interfere with the quality of our life there, I think. 00:53:07
That if this enhances us. 00:53:12
To have the church there, and I urge you. 00:53:14
To please pass this. 00:53:16
Thank you. OK. Thank you. Mr. Kowalski. Mr. Condon, you had your hand up. 00:53:18
When people finish, just wave your hands in the air so I can call on you. 00:53:25
Thanks for opportunity. My name is Charlie Condon and I live down. 00:53:29
Right now from the Church, 835. 00:53:33
And Emily and I have. We've been there for. 00:53:35
Since you go. 00:53:37
4 kids. 00:53:39
We've all attended currently attend Stella Maris and I want to speak to the traffic. 00:53:40
I want to echo what Larry's got to say, Yeah. 00:53:45
Yeah, I'm down there at 835 middle. 00:53:47
Walk to church, typically on Sunday morning. There's cars there, but. 00:53:50
The amount of traffic there. 00:53:55
Compared to what I see. 00:53:57
Here at the restaurant Alley is really minimal. 00:53:59
And I want to speak also to destination weddings quickly. I've had two daughters go through Stella Maris, I can assure you. 00:54:03
They were married at Stellenhaus. I can assure you that it will not become. 00:54:10
A destination wedding venue. 00:54:14
Father Mac. 00:54:17
No, you've got to go through. 00:54:18
Standards. 00:54:21
No cohabitation. 00:54:23
Raise your kid Catholic. 00:54:25
Attend the church regularly. The list goes on. 00:54:26
He focuses in on the sanctity of marriage. 00:54:30
And we're so glad he does. 00:54:33
And so I do want to let the board know that the chance of it being. 00:54:34
The destination wedding venue for the rich and famous. 00:54:39
Is nil. Thank you for the time. 00:54:42
OK. 00:54:45
Go ahead, Mr. Bastus, go ahead. 00:54:48
Madam Chair, Lady members of the Board. 00:55:00
My name is Joe Bustos. I live 649 King St. Mount Pleasant. 00:55:03
And. 00:55:07
I am the state current state representative for Mount Pleasant Sullivan's. I allow palms out to on dog. 00:55:08
And I just want to. 00:55:14
Right up front. 00:55:16
To save time, say I support this endeavor fully. 00:55:17
It's an obligation I feel that we all have. 00:55:21
To make room for the folks that are coming to South Carolina. 00:55:26
And I can tell you from the state. 00:55:30
View We've grown from 3.5 to over 5 million people. 00:55:32
And it's an obligation that we all have to try to accommodate. 00:55:37
Folks have come in here. We're not closing. 00:55:42
The borders, we're not going to shut the bridges. 00:55:44
They're coming. They're here. 00:55:47
And they're going to come to the beach. 00:55:49
On the weekends or any sun or any summer day that they can. 00:55:52
So. 00:55:56
This is this is 1 and we're wrestling with traffic. 00:55:58
In Colombia. 00:56:01
And we know it's bad because we've grown so much. 00:56:03
And I can assure you that we're going to continue to work on that problem. 00:56:07
And if. 00:56:11
Monsignor McInerney has a. 00:56:13
A problem he wants to bring to my attention to bring to the statehouse and reference to traffic. 00:56:15
I'm at his service so I will do that. 00:56:20
With that and I just like to say my view of this. 00:56:25
Is that I spent 3 terms on Mount Pleasant Town Council. 00:56:30
I'm on my third term in the State House. 00:56:35
I've seen the issues you're dealing with. 00:56:38
And I don't envy you. 00:56:40
But we must. 00:56:42
Accommodate the people. 00:56:44
Who are not going to come? They're here. 00:56:46
They're here. 00:56:48
And what a wonderful problem to have that people want to go to church. 00:56:49
So thank you very much. 00:56:53
Thank you. 00:56:56
Who else would like to speak? 00:57:00
I'll be very brief, Mr. Madam Chairman and members of the Board. My name is Michael Maloney. As near as I can figure, I've been 00:57:07
here on Sullivans Island since. 00:57:12
1954. 00:57:16
I remember that because my dad was complaining about. 00:57:18
Renting a house on Brook Street and having to pay $25 a week when he could have paid $75.00 for the whole month. 00:57:21
I also own a. 00:57:28
One of the units of the commissary and I'm a very active member of Stella Maris Church. One thing that's not been brought up. 00:57:30
As we go here, I was looking at the actual. 00:57:36
Bulletin and every week since I've been going to the church where God knows how many years. 00:57:40
It's clear how the machinery puts in there the requirements for someone to be married. In fact, unfortunately. 00:57:45
I have some of my relatives who were unable to get married there because they didn't meet these requirements. 00:57:51
The one other thing that I'd like to say is that Stella Maris is a very conservative church. 00:57:56
We still hold Latin masses and I love going to the Latin masses for those of you who are not Catholic. 00:58:02
That's what I grew up with as a child and it wasn't until Vatican 2 in the late. 00:58:07
1960s if we had English masses. So they're very the population, the people that are. 00:58:12
That are that really interested in traditional Catholic masses are not going to be. 00:58:17
Going to Christchurch, they're going to be looking for Stella Maris and they just aren't that many of us, unfortunately. 00:58:24
So. 00:58:30
Last week in the bulletin, I was the ecumenical minister. Week before that, I was Father Mcinerney's altar boy. 00:58:31
I'm very proud member of Stella Maris. His great institution here on the island has done a lot of good things over the years. My 00:58:37
mother and father have a bell name for them. 00:58:42
And I would strongly encourage you to approve this variance. 00:58:46
Thank you. 00:58:49
Is there anybody here to speak against the variance? 00:58:51
Well, I'm just trying to make sure that both that all sides are heard. 00:58:59
Because what I would like to do right now is if there's not anything new. 00:59:04
I would like I'm going to have you come up. 00:59:09
Don't worry, you're going to get to speak. 00:59:12
I would never leave Father McInerney. 00:59:14
Off. 00:59:16
If you are in favor of the variance, please raise your hand. 00:59:18
No. 00:59:22
Only residents. 00:59:24
Raise their hand and vote as opposed. We're not voting, I'm taking. 00:59:26
Because members of the church are here too. I'm just getting a feeling for the room. This doesn't count in our opinion, in our 00:59:30
discussions, or our opinions. I just want to see how much support there is for and against. 00:59:38
It doesn't weigh in our deliberations. 00:59:46
I just want to give everybody a chance to raise their hand if they want to, so everybody in favor of the variance. 00:59:48
OK. Thank you everybody against the variance. 00:59:56
OK, thank you. I want. I knew they were here. I just wanted to see them. 01:00:02
How many? If you are not at Sullivan's Island resident, raise your hand. 01:00:09
OK, there are a few. 01:00:15
I am going to call him Father. I'm going to close public comment with Father McInerney because we want to get to our 01:00:18
deliberations. 01:00:21
Thank you. And I did want to speak last so I could address questions that came up and so to go through some of the questions. 01:00:28
I think we settled a school issue. 01:00:34
We started a school in 1950. 01:00:36
And here on the island. And a couple years later we moved it to Mount Pleasant. 01:00:38
And as Christ our King, Stella Mayer School. 01:00:42
The question about parishioners recusing themselves? 01:00:45
My understanding is the protocol is that it's up to the parishioner to whether they feel they could. 01:00:48
Are being influenced in any negative way. 01:00:53
And actually at the last meeting, a parishioner voted to table our request. So I think that that's up to them to make that. 01:00:56
Distinction. 01:01:03
Question about monitors for the parking or other conditions. 01:01:04
In 34 years I've never had a neighbor. 01:01:08
Bring me a problem that I couldn't solve. 01:01:12
I think a lot of this is sort of hypothetical. What if? What if? 01:01:15
What if? If that happens, certainly we're going to deal with it. 01:01:18
And again, the parking issue is going to be with determined by dot. We're perfectly willing to have ingress on Osceola and egress 01:01:22
X. 01:01:27
Egress on station 12 if that's what they approve. 01:01:33
As for the increased population of the area. 01:01:36
I will say all of our parishes. 01:01:39
When Solomaris covered everything east of the Cooper. 01:01:42
We now have Christ our King which is substantially just and added on to their church. We have Saint Benedict's up Hwy. 17 N. 01:01:45
We have Saint Clair of Assisi trying to meet this. 01:01:53
Surge in the population. 01:01:57
We is kind of embarrassing to say. As a church we should be out evangelizing and recruiting. We don't even advertise. 01:01:59
And you'll see churches with the High Holy Days, Christmas, Easter advertising their services. We don't even advertise because we 01:02:06
know. 01:02:10
Of our neighborhood and the problems there. 01:02:14
And my person who registers, people will say it isn't easy and we won't try to make it hard to join. 01:02:17
But our priority goes to Solomon's Island, Isle of Palms residence. 01:02:23
And that brings me to something else. 01:02:27
About uh. 01:02:29
Than non residents and this is a point that's very dear to me. 01:02:30
Because. 01:02:34
As I have pointed out. 01:02:35
Estella Maris covered all of East Cooper. 01:02:37
We have families that come to us from Mount Pleasant. 01:02:39
Who are legacy members of Stella Maris? 01:02:42
Some grew up in Stella Maris can no longer afford to live on Sullivan's Island. Is there one contact with the with the community? 01:02:45
And as far as people coming onto the island? 01:02:52
I dare say the majority, vast majority, if not all of your town employees, the people who make this town function. 01:02:56
Do not live on Solomon's. 01:03:02
And if you have a fire? 01:03:04
Or God forbid, drowning incident or danger in this water. 01:03:06
And the volunteers come out. 01:03:10
Of the 42 volunteers. 01:03:12
41 do not live on the island, so we have to be cognizant of that. 01:03:14
There was a legal question. 01:03:19
I'm a church lawyer, I'm not a civil lawyer, but I would like to try to help. I don't know if I'm right on this about the variance 01:03:22
that. 01:03:25
Those that. 01:03:29
This umm. 01:03:30
Statement in the code that nonconformities. 01:03:31
Should not be increased in any manner. 01:03:35
I think the context has to be though. 01:03:38
That these nonconformities are residential. 01:03:40
This is for a residential area as I understand it. 01:03:42
And so if you have a second building non conforming. 01:03:45
I think that's kind of a given. 01:03:48
But this is a different situation. It's not. 01:03:50
A residential area, obviously, although it's zoned as such. 01:03:53
And so then there's the definition of. 01:03:57
Variance where a literal enforcement of the provisions of the zoning ordinance will result in unnecessary hardship. 01:04:00
And so that the spirit of the zoning ordinance shall be observed and substantial justice done. 01:04:07
And I think that has been well demonstrated. 01:04:13
That the increased size is about circulation. 01:04:15
Safety. 01:04:18
Bathroom requirements. 01:04:19
And so forth. 01:04:21
Thank you for your time. 01:04:22
OK. 01:04:26
All right, I am going to close public comment and the board is going to discuss. 01:04:28
We may ask questions of Charles and Eddie. 01:04:35
OK. 01:04:42
I have a question regarding the parking. I know that dot. 01:04:46
Does have the final say but. 01:04:50
There's some latitude in what you can propose. 01:04:53
To the dot right? 01:04:57
Right. But we did the parking lot, but I'm talking about how it relates to this, the current variance and the congestion concern. 01:04:59
I just that's just a question. 01:05:09
I don't feel like there's any. 01:05:14
Part of what's being requested tonight, these variances that. 01:05:18
Parking involved in them. 01:05:24
Right there. 01:05:26
There will be. 01:05:29
DRB Design review board. 01:05:31
Review of parking when that's brought to them. 01:05:34
And they do have. 01:05:37
There is some town control at that stage. 01:05:39
And then dot has control over the ingress and egress, and that's what we did with the special when the special exception was 01:05:43
granted last month. 01:05:47
It included. 01:05:51
Approval of that parking. 01:05:53
Of the ability to put parking. 01:05:56
And so that's. 01:05:58
Not part of this proposal. So what I see is that we're talking about traffic, which. 01:06:00
We can't control. 01:06:06
And there are very, I mean I. 01:06:08
I live. 01:06:10
Near the commercial district I've got traffic. 01:06:12
All day long so. 01:06:14
There is traffic on this island, but as some of the speakers pointed out, it's. 01:06:16
Related to Wednesday night or Wednesday services and Sunday services. 01:06:21
Which is, you know, mostly it's for most of the churches that's the same thing. So. 01:06:26
And they are trying to get. 01:06:33
Part there as far as the traffic, they're trying to get the parking off the street with more parking that will be. 01:06:34
Allowed, um. 01:06:40
Through their parking lot project. 01:06:42
Yeah, go ahead. 01:06:48
Father had a question about. I brought it up earlier with regard to. 01:06:49
Increased frequency and number of. 01:06:55
Members of the congregation that will use the new fellowship hall. 01:07:00
How do you respond to that? 01:07:04
I foresee no. 01:07:07
Radical increase. Interestingly, the best. 01:07:09
A way to track a church's membership. Is attendance actual. 01:07:12
Attendance and it has not varied that much. We have. 01:07:16
More visible crowd outside. Some of our neighbors may see that listening on an external speaker that goes back to Covic. 01:07:20
The church is so small and I think that's what limits. 01:07:27
The numbers. 01:07:30
The size of the church we are adamantly opposed to. 01:07:32
Modifying the church in any way. 01:07:35
It only seats about 250 something like that. 01:07:37
And then the room, the main room. 01:07:41
That what they're calling a meeting room in the hall where we have that one, one extra mass there. 01:07:43
While we're having 9:30 in the church, we have a 930 in the hall. 01:07:49
That is only increasing maybe. What did they say? 5 feet? 01:07:53
At the ages. 01:07:57
Is substantially the same. 01:07:58
Size room. 01:08:01
Because we're trying to accommodate what we have not, not to grow the church. So when do you use the parish hall now? And sorry if 01:08:02
I sound ignorant, I just don't know. It's hardly hardly used. I mean in the sense that the main use of this building will be 01:08:07
Sunday school. 01:08:12
That's like 2 hours on Sunday mornings nine months of the year. 01:08:17
We have like a Bible study, one of the needs in our needs assessment. 01:08:22
The biggest request we got from the parishioners was. 01:08:27
A room smaller than what we call the Large Hall. 01:08:30
The main room. 01:08:33
That could accommodate small groups like 30 people. 01:08:34
And that would accommodate. 01:08:38
Women's Club. Men's club. 01:08:39
Then we would after funerals we don't even have. We used to have lunches. 01:08:41
We can't because the hole is set up. 01:08:46
For mass now. 01:08:48
So that would accommodate that. 01:08:49
So the size of the building's. 01:08:50
As again, the public meeting area is not being expanded radically. A lot of it, as the architects pointed out, is circulation. 01:08:54
The corridors that code requires. 01:09:01
Is that answer. Thank you. 01:09:04
I want to hand the cavalier make the notion. 01:09:22
What do you think? 01:09:26
Michael. 01:09:29
You have any thoughts? 01:09:30
Well, one thought is I just. 01:09:32
Appreciate. 01:09:34
How the? 01:09:36
The church has really worked with the neighborhood from what I can see. 01:09:37
And trying to solve. 01:09:40
Issues related to the design and. 01:09:43
Limiting the building and. 01:09:46
And just taking the. 01:09:47
And the people of sullivans island into account in. 01:09:50
Kind of almost every aspect of what you're doing and I. 01:09:53
It helps me. 01:09:58
To be somewhat assured that. 01:09:59
The few problems that. 01:10:02
Were hypothetically mentioned. 01:10:04
They'll be taken care of in the future. Yeah, I just, I really appreciate what you did in your deep dive on. 01:10:07
What, what did you know? What's the major cause of the what's the use of the additional square footage and how will it be used? 01:10:14
And. 01:10:17
Taking it out to the doing the comparison, I'm glad you did the square footage comparison because I knew last time. 01:10:21
It was not going to be the largest building on Sullivan's Island because I work in one of the largest buildings. 01:10:27
But I do appreciate that you. 01:10:33
You found some to cut. You went and dove down into the explanations about. 01:10:35
About why so it makes perfect sense. 01:10:40
You know you want to be able to. 01:10:43
Have wheelchairs passed in your corridor and have handicapped accessibility for your for your common areas in your bathrooms and 01:10:45
kitchens so. 01:10:48
I do appreciate the time you took to do that. 01:10:52
To that note. 01:10:59
I would say that. 01:11:00
Everybody wants to know the answer. 01:11:02
Right, because there's a traffic dancer. There's this answer. 01:11:05
And. 01:11:09
I think that everyone in this room is looking at it. 01:11:10
At a global perspective and. 01:11:13
You know, I think that. 01:11:16
Again. 01:11:17
Part of the puzzle. 01:11:18
I think the guardrails are in place. 01:11:20
With DRB. 01:11:23
And dot. 01:11:25
To answer some of the questions that will inevitably not get answered here today. 01:11:27
But will come to. 01:11:34
Some smart resolution. As we move this thing, it will increase some of the nonconformity it is. 01:11:37
You know the other churches that are have that are zoned religious. 01:11:47
Holy Cross has three buildings on. 01:11:53
On our land. 01:11:58
Which is 3 lots that were. 01:11:59
Put together so it's three buildings, so. 01:12:01
Churches don't exist in just one building, so. 01:12:04
It's how they operate as well. 01:12:07
They've not. They have increased some of the. 01:12:10
Nonconformities. 01:12:13
Management. 01:12:19
Improve, you know, improved accessibility. 01:12:22
Umm, and so I think the, they've offset some of the, the. 01:12:25
Expansion if you will have been offset in a good way. 01:12:30
Yeah, I agree. And it appears to me that. 01:12:34
You couldn't even build the structure the way it is now, so to the extent that. 01:12:37
You know the hardship exists. You could not rebuild this in the same footprint it is now, with the limitations imposed by. 01:12:43
Safety and codes and everything else and. 01:12:51
It looks like the portion that of the expansion. 01:12:55
Is very minimal. 01:12:58
As far as the expansion of meeting space as opposed to expansion. 01:13:00
Of circulation and the ability. 01:13:05
To get around and to have safe ingress and egress from the building so. 01:13:08
I think it does create a hardship. 01:13:13
That couldn't be overcome just to. 01:13:17
Maintain the current space. So that's that's my. 01:13:19
Input on that. 01:13:22
Mr. Favor, another question is that true that you couldn't build? 01:13:24
The current structure compliant with building code in the same footprint as the existing building. 01:13:30
Or is it you could do it? 01:13:36
But you just have much less. 01:13:38
Usable space. 01:13:40
Everything inside the train. 01:13:48
Our meeting during our class completely. 01:13:49
So of course you could build it on that footprint. 01:13:52
But it would not serve as congregation and be significantly smaller. 01:13:56
And the meeting space couldn't be configured the same and the meeting space itself would be. 01:14:01
Severely restricted so you couldn't build it as is. 01:14:06
On this. 01:14:11
Yeah, right. 01:14:12
Good point. 01:14:15
Now .1 thing out about the. 01:14:17
The discussion of nonconformity. 01:14:19
So we have a non conforming condition. 01:14:22
That will go away. 01:14:25
It wouldn't be expanded. 01:14:28
By granting these variances, there would be no nonconformity. 01:14:30
Because it would be conforming based on the variances to the ordinance that would be allowing it to exist in conformity. 01:14:34
It would be. 01:14:44
By virtue of granting the variances, it would be conforming to its standard, so we would be varying the ordinance. 01:14:47
To accommodate the building the utilization of the property. 01:14:54
Thank you. 01:15:01
You want me to hand over the gavel and I do it or when y'all want to do it? 01:15:17
You gotta put a motion on the floor. 01:15:20
I want to do a much interpretation. 01:15:26
You know you can do it in my car. 01:15:32
Want me to do? 01:15:35
I'm handing over the gavel so I can make the motion. 01:15:40
Do I don't get carried away? 01:15:45
Bridget, I'm not going to repeat the whole thing. 01:15:56
I'm just gonna. 01:15:58
Basically, I'm going to make a motion to approve. 01:16:00
The variance request. 01:16:06
For 1204, Middle St. in its entirety. 01:16:08
And based on. 01:16:14
Our findings in section 21179. 01:16:19
They're extraordinary and exceptional conditions pertaining to this particular piece of property as this is and has been a 01:16:24
religious use prior to the establishment of the town's zoning ordinance. 01:16:30
These conditions do not generally apply to other property in the vicinity, so the because only the only the other church partials. 01:16:37
Parcels on the island have this distinction. 01:16:46
Because of these conditions, the application of the zoning ordinance. 01:16:50
To the particular piece of property would effectively prohibit. 01:16:53
Or unreasonably restrict the utilization of the property. 01:16:57
Because without approval of these variances, the existing parish hall would continue to deteriorate. 01:17:01
And would remain non conforming to the Rs district standards. 01:17:06
Sorry. 01:17:12
I have several pieces of paper here. 01:17:14
In addition. 01:17:19
The improvements in the non conforming setbacks and impervious coverage will enhance the neighborhood compatibility and increase 01:17:20
massing and coverage are countered by the majority of the Massings location. 01:17:26
Closer to the adjacent commercial governmental use of the Fort Moultrie Visitor Center. 01:17:31
And the increase in principal building coverage and square footage are both offset by the important reduction in impervious 01:17:36
coverage. 01:17:39
Which will allow the larger building to better address stormwater concerns in the area. 01:17:43
Rather than the existing smaller building with its asphalt parking lot. 01:17:48
And also it will improve accessibility and bathroom facilities as those are the main drivers of the increased footprint. 01:17:52
And this will enhance public safety and provide a more accommodating space for patrons, especially those with special needs. 01:17:59
Therefore, the fourth point is authorization of a variance. 01:18:07
Will not be of substantial detriment to the adjacent property or to the public good. 01:18:11
And the granting of the variance will not harm the character of the district. 01:18:15
The proposed building would enhance the visual appeal of the property, would improve on nonconformities that detract from the 01:18:19
neighborhood compatibility. 01:18:24
And would improve the handling of stormwater on the property to the benefit of the neighboring. 01:18:28
Properties. 01:18:33
Their second. 01:18:38
2nd. 01:18:39
Discussion. 01:18:43
I have no discussion. 01:18:46
All those in favor say Huh? 01:18:50
Aye. 01:18:54
I don't do that. 01:19:04
We'll take a short break, as we have. 01:19:12
There are three more items on our agenda, so you must leave quietly, please. 01:19:22
I told you most of the people will be there. 01:19:31
Now it's all nice and calm. Aren't y'all glad? 01:19:40
We got through that. 01:19:43
We are going to take the next two items on the agenda together because they are the exact same. 01:19:46
Issue. 01:19:54
We're going to bundle them. 01:19:55
1010 Osceola. 01:19:57
And 1018 Osceola requesting variances from section 2113. 01:20:00
To allow the importation of fill materials onto the lot, increasing lot elevations by. 01:20:06
More than one foot above the existing grades and from 21139 B two and three to allow a fence. 01:20:12
Made of materials other than wood or metal and to allow a fence. 01:20:18
Without any openings across its plane. Charles, please present for the town. 01:20:21
Thank you, Madam Chair. 01:20:27
As stated, this is a request for variances at the properties. 01:20:30
Adjust is 1010 and 1018 Osceola Ave. These are in the Rs zoning district. You can see these arrows are pointing to 10/18 on the 01:20:34
right and 10:10 on the left. 01:20:39
Here are postings on these properties advertising tonight's meeting. 01:20:47
And this is an elevation map showing these are. 01:20:54
Two of the lowest properties on the island. 01:20:59
Rebecca, would you care to speak to this? 01:21:03
A little bit. 01:21:05
Rebecca is our Natural Resource and Resilience Director for the Island and has helped me with some of these graphics and I'd like 01:21:07
to let her. 01:21:12
Speak to them. 01:21:16
Thank you. Yeah, looking at mean elevation of the. 01:21:18
Parcels in question that average elevation is. 01:21:23
Below the road elevation on average. 01:21:28
And you can see by that purple shading just a categorization that shows. 01:21:33
That many of the parcels around it are also very low. 01:21:39
And if you will. 01:21:44
Yes, thank you. 01:21:47
And this is important to note for this particular portion of the island as it. 01:21:50
Holds into the stormwater master plan that was adopted by council. 01:21:55
And drafted by Seaman and Whiteside. 01:22:00
And here we can see. 01:22:02
That if we did nothing, if we made no stormwater improvements, then in 50 years. 01:22:05
A high tide and a foot of rain would do this to that neighborhood. 01:22:11
So that is just sort of the flood model prediction of what that neighborhood would look like in 2075 with 100 year rain at high 01:22:16
tide. 01:22:20
But if the town is able to achieve its storm water master plan, then. 01:22:26
We would see that much of the flooding would be resolved for those low properties that are between or on the. 01:22:33
Beachside of Osceola Ave. and that's because Osceola Ave. would have been raised according to this plan. 01:22:43
To an elevation of 6 feet or 7 feet high. 01:22:50
And possibly doing that in stages. 01:22:56
Because that's a lot of. 01:22:59
Grade raised for a road to go from about four and a half feet high. 01:23:02
To six feet high is already a big step, and then to get it even up to 7 feet high based on. 01:23:07
Some of the predictions of sea level and rain. 01:23:12
Of the future. 01:23:17
That would sort of be the direction we would be heading and that would leave that whole neighborhood there between ocean and the 01:23:19
marsh. 01:23:22
Out of the protection plan for that neighborhood, so. 01:23:26
If we go to the next slide, we'll see. 01:23:30
What those properties look like, there's fourteen in total. 01:23:33
That would not be protected by. 01:23:37
The the Osceola Rd. being raised or the storm water drainage improvements to the piping system in that neighborhood either. 01:23:40
And if we look at the ten lowest properties on average on the island. 01:23:50
Then we would see that there are a few of them. 01:23:56
In the immediate vicinity. 01:24:01
And the two in question today are and 2nd and 4th place. 01:24:03
Respectively. 01:24:08
Thank you, Rebecca. 01:24:13
And then looking specifically at what's being requested. 01:24:15
For you today, this is. 01:24:20
At 10:10 Osceola Ave. This is the. 01:24:22
Survey from 2000. You can see the OCRM. 01:24:26
Critical line right here. 01:24:31
And then this is the proposed plan. 01:24:33
For this property with the. 01:24:36
This wall basically following the OCRM critical line just on the. 01:24:39
Landward side of that. 01:24:44
And then I've color-coded the. 01:24:48
Property. So everything in this pink is. 01:24:50
Areas of the existing grade that are below 4 feet. 01:24:54
In the blue we have areas of existing grade that are between 4:00 and 5:00 feet. 01:24:59
In the green it is the areas between 5:00 and 6:00 feet and then this small little hill. 01:25:05
Which we can see back in those previous slides. 01:25:12
Is the area that's about 6 feet. 01:25:16
And then if you look at these contour lines, these are the proposed fill for this lot. 01:25:20
Umm, with much of the. 01:25:27
The fill going on the. 01:25:29
Interior side of the wall, kind of creating a slope up to the. 01:25:31
The wall that would be proposed. 01:25:36
And then? 01:25:39
Out here in the front yard, a lot of fill over. 01:25:40
In some places 2 1/2 feet of fill would be added to this lot. 01:25:44
A little bit more in some other areas. 01:25:47
Looking next door at 10:18. 01:25:55
Seal Ave. This is. 01:25:58
The This is a house that is currently under construction. 01:26:00
And this is the approved site plan for this property. 01:26:05
And you can see that they were. 01:26:10
Approved working within the grades of the existing property. 01:26:13
And this is the proposed plan which. 01:26:17
Again, shows a wall right inside of the critical line. 01:26:20
And we've got grades. 01:26:24
Up to the grading, grading, up to the building pad in this case, and then down away into. 01:26:27
Storm water drains on either side of the. 01:26:35
Backyard. 01:26:38
That would outflow into the marsh. 01:26:39
Through 6 inch conduits. 01:26:42
And then grading down into elevated ditches along the Osceola Ave. 01:26:44
You can see the. 01:26:50
Proposed elevations are about 6 1/2 feet. 01:26:51
On the edge of the slab. 01:26:55
Which is. 01:26:59
Contrary to what was approved, it was approved at a 5 1/2 foot slabs of their. 01:27:02
Some questions to whether that would work having the fill go higher than the slab. 01:27:06
This is the approved storm water plan for this property. 01:27:15
I've highlighted on this the. 01:27:21
Line. That's the limits of moderate wave action. 01:27:24
It's an area that. 01:27:27
C Word of this line, there are special requirements for construction. 01:27:32
Typically the. 01:27:38
Construction requirements are that of a visa. 01:27:40
There's question as to whether or not. 01:27:45
Landscape fill would be prohibited. 01:27:47
Seaward of the Lenoir Line and. 01:27:51
I think DES or OCM would need to approve. 01:27:55
And he fell on the. 01:27:58
Water side the up. 01:28:01
The top side of this. 01:28:04
Map where there's a lot of fill being proposed if we look at the previous slide. 01:28:06
This has us up at 5:00. 01:28:11
5 1/2 feet 575 for the drop inlets. 01:28:15
Where's the critical line on that line? 01:28:20
If you look just outside of the. 01:28:22
Got it. OK, I see it. That's the critical line with the wall just on the inside of the critical line. 01:28:25
And on the. 01:28:34
Approved plan. 01:28:36
You can see the critical line right here. 01:28:37
And that's. 01:28:43
Three years ago. When does that critical line get redrawn? 01:28:45
It would it would be redrawn it. 01:28:51
The final survey for as built survey. 01:28:54
They would they would be retaliating it at that time. 01:28:57
One other thing to point out. 01:29:01
You know this plan that is being shown to y'all tonight? 01:29:04
Has not been. 01:29:09
Through staff review. 01:29:12
One thing I would note. 01:29:15
As the approved plan has a small driveway. 01:29:17
This has a much larger driveway that wraps around the side of the house. None of this has been. 01:29:21
Reviewed or vetted and approved by staff. At this point, this was the first time that we've seen this plan. 01:29:28
Was during this uh. 01:29:34
Variance request. So this is This is what is approved. 01:29:36
This driveway right here. 01:29:40
So the requests are for the importation of more than a foot of. 01:29:45
Fell over the existing grade. 01:29:52
On both both of these two lots. 01:29:55
Some areas up to 2 1/2 feet of fill. 01:29:57
Are being proposed. 01:29:59
And then defense regulations. 01:30:01
Currently walls are not a permitted thing, so. 01:30:05
The only real way. 01:30:09
Achieve a wall is through a variance to the fence requirements. Umm. 01:30:11
Which require a fence to be 25% open and that that is intended to allow breezes and visual flow. 01:30:17
Into properties. 01:30:26
And then the needed materials to create a. 01:30:28
Seawall would would not be. 01:30:32
What we would. 01:30:36
Typically find an offense. 01:30:37
What are their proposed materials? 01:30:39
We do not actually know the proposed materials. 01:30:41
So there are 4 variants. 01:30:49
Finding findings of hardship that must be present in order to grant a variance. 01:30:52
These are that they're extraordinary exceptional conditions pertaining to the particular piece of property. 01:30:59
These conditions did not generally apply to other properties. 01:31:05
In the vicinity and because of these conditions, the application of the zoning ordinance to the particular piece of property would 01:31:09
effectively. 01:31:13
Prohibit or unreasonably restrict the utilization of the property. 01:31:16
And the authorization of the variance will not be of substantial detriment to adjacent property or to the public good, and the 01:31:20
granting of the variance will not harm the character of the district. 01:31:25
It seems that I'm missing a slide. 01:31:32
That's odd, I'm going to look for it in another place. 01:31:39
With apologies. 01:31:43
Interesting. 01:31:49
I'm sorry. 01:31:52
Umm. 01:31:53
What can I say? 01:31:59
Let me just say that. 01:32:03
Staff does does not feel that. 01:32:06
Go back to that slide with the. 01:32:10
Yeah, that was lovely. 01:32:16
So I do believe. 01:32:21
Her staff does believe that there are extraordinary exceptional conditions related to these pieces of property. 01:32:23
They are very low and their elevation is below that of the. 01:32:29
Crown of the Street. 01:32:34
And such there. 01:32:36
There are conditions that generally do not apply outside of this very. 01:32:38
Small vicinity of parcels. 01:32:43
However. 01:32:46
There there is not a finding that the application of. 01:32:48
The zoning ordinance will prohibit or unreasonably restrict the utilization of the property that. 01:32:54
You know one house has been there for 100 years as. 01:33:01
Still utilized. 01:33:05
Well, and there may be. 01:33:07
Other alternative means by which to protect the property from rising waters. 01:33:08
And the other house is currently under construction. 01:33:13
And such that. 01:33:18
It seems that someone felt it was. 01:33:20
A viable place to build a nice home. 01:33:22
And plans to utilize it and I think that they certainly are able to. 01:33:25
Without the granting of a variance. 01:33:30
To the fourth point. 01:33:33
It may be of substantial detriment to the public good and to the public trust doctrine to build a. 01:33:36
Wall against the edge of the critical line. 01:33:45
Thereby, umm. 01:33:48
Tearing away Marsh. 01:33:51
Through umm. 01:33:53
Reflection of waves along that wall. 01:33:55
During high tides. 01:33:58
And scouring at the edges of the wall on adjacent properties that would. 01:34:00
Remove property from the adjacent properties. 01:34:06
High ground. 01:34:10
What that staff does not recommend approval of this variance request. 01:34:11
I apologize for that slide being missing. 01:34:16
No problem. OK. Any questions for Charles before we hear from that? 01:34:19
Closely are in that a say in. 01:34:24
With a virtual wall. 01:34:27
I believe that they do as far as. 01:34:32
Being in the Lomo. 01:34:34
And, umm. 01:34:36
Being a structure that. 01:34:38
Reflect waves potentially negatively impacting the marsh and the adjacent properties. Yes, it would be something that OCRM would 01:34:40
need to approve. 01:34:44
And then so the idea is, what are they looking? 01:34:50
Because. 01:34:53
The stormwater plan. 01:34:53
And the raising of the road will make lots more vulnerable. 01:34:56
That that is the proposed reason and I would point out. 01:35:03
When we look back at Rebecca's. 01:35:08
Slide. 01:35:11
Which actually comes from ceiling lights out of this data. 01:35:13
This is the proposed condition if Osceola were improved. 01:35:17
And elevated. 01:35:21
If you look at these two lots and then we'll go to the. 01:35:23
Condition if the road is not elevated. 01:35:27
It really does not impact. 01:35:30
The level of flooding on these. 01:35:33
Properties. 01:35:36
They will flood in either scenario. 01:35:38
And I. 01:35:42
Can you give us a little bit more information about, I mean, we're working on the storm water plan and so. 01:35:44
And see, it's not set yet. I mean we have some. 01:35:50
Some more work on the on the plan to do. 01:35:54
Excuse me to do and get it accomplished. 01:35:56
Before 2020. 01:35:59
75 when it. 01:36:00
I won't be here. We've approved this plan. 01:36:02
And it will be funded in phases, as we can get grants that fund these projects. 01:36:06
We have not. 01:36:13
Sought a grant to elevate Osceola yet and. 01:36:15
Do not have that on the. 01:36:20
One plate currently, but you think the impact on the lots would be? 01:36:23
From a lot of perspective. 01:36:31
I think. 01:36:34
It would not. 01:36:35
Be a terribly impactful change for these lots. It would still. 01:36:38
Flood umm. 01:36:43
I think that that. 01:36:44
It's hard to say for sure, but I'll ask Rebecca too. 01:36:47
Sure. Yeah, there. And excuse me, I'm a little hard of hearing, I had a hard time hearing your question, but I think I understood. 01:36:50
New stormwater plan and the raising of Osceola. 01:37:01
Goes into effect right? There would actually be little to no change in flooding for the lots on the marsh side of Osceola. 01:37:05
As a result of that. 01:37:14
Project as far as tidal flood water level. 01:37:16
Any unintended impact? 01:37:20
Groundwater. 01:37:23
Or stormwater flooding would need to be thoroughly assessed to reduce impacts to adjacent properties at the time. 01:37:25
That that road project was pursued. 01:37:33
Yeah, they send the storm water somewhere, right? 01:37:37
Yeah, yeah, OK. 01:37:39
Yes. 01:37:42
Yes. 01:37:44
The smaller existing house. 01:37:45
Very close to the ground. 01:37:47
As it is right now. 01:37:51
Correct. 01:37:52
2 feet. 01:37:54
Is it? 01:37:56
So. 01:37:58
Require at that point raising the structure. 01:38:00
The the actual proposal is to raise the grade around that house. 01:38:03
See the. 01:38:13
The proposal is to elevate the edge. 01:38:14
Along the the wall. So to draw water back in, collect it between the. 01:38:17
Wall and the house and then outfall it. 01:38:24
I believe. 01:38:27
I'm not sure that that's. 01:38:30
The best outcome for the House, I think that. 01:38:31
I think that raising the house a couple of feet would be a better solution. 01:38:34
Ultimately, yes, for this for the structure itself. 01:38:40
Earthworks that. 01:38:45
To alleviate. 01:38:48
That are potentially immediate that situation correct property. 01:38:50
I don't know what it's like in a ticket or something. 01:38:55
But one would assume that. 01:39:00
Since it has a building permit above. 01:39:02
A squad and you know there's no issue. 01:39:05
Yeah, it's on a. 01:39:09
Is it on the floating? 01:39:10
What's the? 01:39:12
OK. 01:39:14
But yeah, it. 01:39:16
It was approved. 01:39:19
The first floor is elevated. 01:39:22
Above. 01:39:25
And nobody can really say. 01:39:26
But they're raising us know what happened? 01:39:29
Next year or 25 years ago? 01:39:31
Correct. 01:39:33
I do think it is a plan and it is something that the town. 01:39:34
We don't has has a. 01:39:38
The audience has a goal of achieving. 01:39:40
I'm going to ask a question. 01:39:45
What? 01:39:47
Is the result. 01:39:51
If we. 01:39:52
A hypothetically approved the fill and didn't approve the seawall. 01:39:54
I'm calling it a seawall, whatever it is, a seawall. 01:40:00
On the marsh. 01:40:03
Or is it? Or is this bound together for some? 01:40:05
Reason that I would not be aware of. 01:40:08
It is not bound together. 01:40:10
I would think from the engineer's perspective they are bound together. 01:40:15
Just a question. Yeah, but I would. 01:40:20
Perhaps that's a question to ask the. 01:40:24
The engineer applicant if if. 01:40:26
There would be a possibility to. 01:40:29
Build 1 without the other. 01:40:31
But I think it would need to be re engineered if you're. 01:40:33
If you want my opinion. 01:40:35
I I want to be I want clarification that the. 01:40:41
Drawing that's being presented to us is not. 01:40:44
What's actually approved to be built? 01:40:49
As far as the. 01:40:51
Driveway and. 01:40:53
You just said that that's correct. The approved plan is on the left. The is that what they've submitted the right on with the 01:40:56
application. This was submitted with the application. 01:41:01
I have a question are the? 01:41:11
Basically the building condition, general conditions. 01:41:13
On the lot that's not being built on, are they similar? 01:41:16
To the lot that have. 01:41:21
They're going to construct on, in other words. 01:41:23
Would a structure be approved to be put on that? 01:41:27
That lot. 01:41:31
On the. 01:41:32
The 1010 lot, yeah. 01:41:34
Yes. 01:41:37
It's a buildable lot. 01:41:38
It has a historic house on it today. 01:41:40
And then there was a house on this lot prior to a construction that was torn down and this. 01:41:43
New homes nearing completion. 01:41:49
Removing the historical house? No, Sir. 01:41:52
No, Sir. 01:41:55
No, they would have to get a separate driveway permit. 01:42:04
That is, I'll say right now I'm not going to do anything. 01:42:08
I. 01:42:17
The interview. 01:42:22
I believe it's being proposed as a pervious. 01:42:27
What correct? 01:42:30
Yes, I can learn to not approve anything. 01:42:32
Form the planning. 01:42:37
That is not going through staff and he has been free. 01:42:39
For the expansion of blackout, which may be for committees. 01:42:44
It's says it's proposed as pervious but. 01:42:50
We don't. 01:42:55
We have not reviewed it. 01:42:58
Can't prove. 01:43:05
A request for plan that. 01:43:07
In my opinion, but I don't think that's what we're being asked to approve. 01:43:12
Tonight as far as the driveway is concerned. 01:43:20
Crap. 01:43:23
Approved improvements to Earth. 01:43:25
Approve a project on this lot. 01:43:29
With a plan. 01:43:32
I just had a problem. 01:43:35
This is this is going back. 01:43:37
Things used to come to us before they've been completely vetted. 01:43:40
And we approved something that. 01:43:43
Let's go ahead and hear from that. 01:43:50
Please say your name please. 01:43:59
Good evening. I'm Jay Harper. I'm the contractor for 10/18 Osceola that is currently under construction. 01:44:03
Kind of representing Robert Eversold, my client, and Mary Mueller next door. 01:44:10
For I'm going to give you a little bit of the why, and then Kevin is here from Steven Whiteside to give you the science of how we 01:44:17
ended up at this plan. 01:44:20
The the the. 01:44:26
The quick back story is that. 01:44:28
During construction between when the house was demoed, the previous house was demolished where we got to. 01:44:30
We had some significant flooding events in. 01:44:37
What we're talking about is tidal flooding, not not water, not rain. 01:44:42
Or anything. 01:44:46
And, umm. 01:44:47
Got married, who is 94 years old and lives at 1010 Osceola. 01:44:50
The nicest lady you'll ever meet. 01:44:57
And and I kind of developed a friendship through construction. 01:45:00
And Jennifer, her daughter here. 01:45:03
And I. 01:45:06
Started talking in October of last year. 01:45:08
About. 01:45:13
What we could do, because at that point there is a couple of. 01:45:14
Storm and tide events that. 01:45:20
Prevented Mary from being able to access her property. 01:45:23
The majority of the tide. 01:45:26
Comes up the drainage ditch between the homes and the street. 01:45:28
Crosses over the street, floods the street, and the entire street is flooded at significant tides. Not a normal high tide, but at 01:45:34
a normal high tide it is. 01:45:38
It is in the drainage ditch over our driveways and you have to drive through. 01:45:42
Or walk through water to access the homes. 01:45:47
At that same time was when the preliminary site or the preliminary master plan came out from Steven Whiteside in October. 01:45:53
And we saw where the the proposed plan was to raise the street. 01:46:02
We kind of thought. 01:46:08
Now is the time to do something about this. 01:46:09
We talked with some people from the town. 01:46:12
We engaged Seaman Whiteside on a preliminary basis. 01:46:14
What can we do? What should we do? 01:46:20
And. 01:46:22
Kind of got the ball rolling with. 01:46:25
Getting surveys done. 01:46:27
The survey on 10/18 Osceola was certified by the state on. 01:46:29
May 26, 2022. 01:46:34
The one for 1010, Osceola was certified in December of last year when we had it resurveyed. 01:46:36
That's why you see the big kind of jut in in between the two properties that was not there previous, because that's what the OCR 01:46:41
online changed. 01:46:45
Through the course of working through the town plan. 01:46:54
The I believe it was 14 properties were essentially left out of what the town is doing to. 01:46:58
Address flooding in the areas. 01:47:05
And from the plan that the town accepted, I realized there's some questions about whether it's funded or not. But. 01:47:09
You know, this is what the town has put forward as what they're going to do. 01:47:17
The the plan the language changed, but in the one that actually got adopted on March 18th, 2025 said that the town should 01:47:22
encourage and allow property owners. 01:47:26
To fill and protect their properties. 01:47:31
Against an appropriate title mitigation target. 01:47:34
And it goes on to set that target at 7 feet. 01:47:37
Which is the final goal of where to get Osceola Ave. at? 01:47:40
Quickly to. 01:47:47
Talk about the. 01:47:49
The Tanning Osceola site plan being a little different. 01:47:50
Once we realized and we started talking with Semen Whiteside. 01:47:54
The reason that the driveway area changed is originally we were talking about culverting and filling that area to create parking. 01:47:59
Which we would be allowed to do. 01:48:08
But that would not work with what? 01:48:10
Would happen in the future. 01:48:13
So part of what our plan. 01:48:15
Did was adapt to that? This is adapted several times over the course of finalizing. 01:48:19
The the town's plan. 01:48:25
And the meeting with the resiliency team which gave us some feedback at their last meeting here, which we changed our plan again 01:48:28
after that. 01:48:32
We moved the driving the parking area which is pervious. 01:48:39
Onto the the properties because that last. 01:48:43
Part of the right away at the street is basically becoming sacrificial. 01:48:47
It's going to fill with water at the high tide until. 01:48:51
The town is able to implement part of their plan. 01:48:55
At the end. 01:48:58
Of Mary's property at 1010 Osceola. 01:49:00
Part of that actually extends over into what I think is town property, but it's off of her property line. 01:49:04
And the master plan calls for some work to be done there on the town's behalf to prevent the water from back flowing up into that 01:49:09
property. 01:49:13
And until that is done, there's not a lot we can do there that the plan is to plant some grasses that will help absorb, help keep 01:49:19
the. 01:49:22
The the natural drainage from eroding. 01:49:27
And I'm sorry, I'll let Kevin get into that. 01:49:29
My understanding was that we needed to get. 01:49:33
An approval on the fill. 01:49:36
So that we have the parameters. 01:49:38
That we can finalize our site plan with that would then come to the town for approval. 01:49:40
Because if we don't get approval for the fill. 01:49:46
Our overall site plan is going to have to look. 01:49:49
A lot different than what this is. 01:49:52
So in order for us to know what we can do, we have to know what we're allowed to do. 01:49:54
And with that, I'm going to turn it over to Kevin from Steven Whiteside, who can talk about the science of stuff. 01:49:58
Hello everybody, Kevin Heron, engineer at Semen Whiteside. 01:50:10
Drafted the. 01:50:14
Grading and drainage plant. 01:50:16
For the two sites. 01:50:17
And produce the technical memorandum that was provided in the application. 01:50:19
I wanted to start with. 01:50:25
1010 Osceola. 01:50:26
Kind of separated them. 01:50:27
Is there a separate applications? 01:50:29
I'll start with why the project is necessary. 01:50:32
So, 1010 Osceola is a nationally registered historic home. 01:50:35
Built in the late 1800s. 01:50:41
One of the oldest and lowest lying properties north of the island. 01:50:43
The property sits directly adjacent to the open marsh. 01:50:48
On the left side. 01:50:51
And behind property. 01:50:53
With no form of flood protection. 01:50:55
Making it severely at risk for repetitive tidal flooding. 01:50:57
Now within the past two years. 01:51:00
There have been extreme tide events. 01:51:02
That have completely flooded Osceola Ave. 01:51:04
Which I had pictures in my tech memo. 01:51:07
You guys have seen? 01:51:09
Yeah, and. 01:51:12
OK. And I also had this other photo. 01:51:14
That I wanted to share if I could. 01:51:17
Of 10/10. 01:51:20
I could bring it up. 01:51:22
Yeah, just. 01:51:35
And that was just during an extreme high tide event within the past two years. 01:51:39
So this leaves the homeowner and emergency emergency vehicles unable to access the driveway. 01:51:44
And the SO, the recently adopted Stormwater Master Plan, outlines recommendations for the flood mitigation projects. 01:51:49
Noting the raising of Osceola as the highest priority project. 01:51:56
To an elevation of seven feet. 01:52:02
And. 01:52:04
What was shown in the presentation shows that. 01:52:05
It will help in England. 01:52:08
Flooding, but it will leave these properties on the island essentially. 01:52:10
And recommends that the property owners provide lot level grading. 01:52:15
And fill to prevent flooding in their properties. 01:52:18
So what the project is on 10/10? 01:52:23
So the installation of the landscape. 01:52:26
Across the neck of the property, along the critically. 01:52:28
The state certified critical wetland limits. 01:52:32
And the top of the wall is for. 01:52:35
Proposed at 7 feet. 01:52:37
To meet that final target elevation. 01:52:38
Stated. 01:52:41
Stormwater Master. 01:52:43
And also surrounding communities such as Iowa Palms. 01:52:44
Pawleys Island. 01:52:48
And Folly Beach, which I've also mentioned, targeting elevations of 6 1/2 to 7 feet. 01:52:49
The grated berm was evaluated at 1010 Osceola Ave. 01:52:56
But due to the existing grades in the backyard. 01:53:00
At the critical wetland. 01:53:04
And the space between that and the home. 01:53:06
There's no feasible. 01:53:09
Proper way to grade A? 01:53:11
In this area. 01:53:13
If we could go back to that. 01:53:15
Plan. 01:53:17
So as you can see in the back of the back of the home, there's very, very minimal space between. 01:53:20
The actual structure. 01:53:25
And the critical wetland line. 01:53:27
Leaving us with. 01:53:30
Landscape wall as the. 01:53:32
Feasible alternative? 01:53:34
To prevent flooding from the marshland side. 01:53:36
Which is all elevation based. 01:53:39
And the remainder of the site. 01:53:42
Was graded to 6 and 6 1/2 along the wall within the property. 01:53:45
The grading will. 01:53:49
Produce flow not towards the foundation of the building, but towards that yard inlet in the back. 01:53:50
To be discharged into the marsh. 01:53:56
So that was taken into consideration. 01:53:58
Integrating plan. 01:54:00
Because of the overall goal is to prevent. 01:54:02
Structural damage to the historic property in the home. 01:54:05
Continue to be usable. 01:54:08
And so if nothing is done to this property even after the town's Osceola project. 01:54:11
The property will continue to repetitively flood as you see in the picture there. 01:54:17
With intensity projected to increase in the future, these title. 01:54:22
Floods will continue to rise in elevation. 01:54:26
And. 01:54:28
Regardless of Osceola, raising the marshland behind would still be. 01:54:30
Flooding towards. 01:54:36
The property. 01:54:38
Kind of leaving it. 01:54:39
On an island, as I mentioned from from the flood mitigation. 01:54:41
That would be provided by the Osceola Raising Project. 01:54:45
Now, by performing these improvements, the property owner can sleep at night knowing that. 01:54:49
At least our driveway will be accessible by them and emergency vehicles in flood scenarios. 01:54:54
And that their home and foundation will be better protected from flooding. 01:54:59
For the next 50 years. 01:55:03
So I was going to move to 10/18. 01:55:07
Yes, that's right. 01:55:10
Sorry, landscape wall so. 01:55:15
I would like to know what are the materials of this seawall that's being proposed. 01:55:17
Yeah, it's a seawall. 01:55:23
I would have to. 01:55:27
It's a boy, it's a wood, but we're professing. 01:55:28
Thank you. 01:55:31
Thanks. 01:55:33
And how long has the individual owned? 01:55:36
Sorry, since the 1950s. 01:55:41
I I. 01:55:46
I'll go ahead. 01:55:54
I grew up across the street from the Muller's. 01:55:56
OK, on King Street. 01:55:59
Yeah. So we've, I've known them for a long time, Yeah. 01:56:01
What happens if you are alive but until the not be well, yeah. 01:56:06
The. 01:56:11
Tidal elevations will continue to rise, and the fill will eventually become. 01:56:13
Unsustainable and won't do the job. It won't prevent flooding. 01:56:19
In the property. 01:56:22
Just because like I mentioned, the minimal amounts of space. 01:56:23
Between the marsh. 01:56:26
Which the town has no jurisdiction in the marsh, so it kind of leaves. 01:56:27
The town's drainage improvements to be within the public right of way. 01:56:32
Hence the Osceola project. 01:56:36
And so these specific properties. 01:56:38
Are almost forced to do the improvements, lot level improvements by themselves. 01:56:41
Yeah, well, the town can't. 01:56:52
Tide from coming up the back. I mean, that's just not, I mean, you can't, you can't mitigate that. Yeah. 01:56:54
Yeah, you can move on to 10/18. 01:57:03
OK, please. 01:57:05
So the the. 01:57:07
Reasoning for the project is very similar, synonymous to 10/10. 01:57:08
During construction over the last two years became evident that improvements were needed when these. 01:57:13
Extreme high tide events that we're currently experiencing, we're reaching up to the new foundation elevation, basically flooding. 01:57:19
The entire property up to this level. 01:57:24
And these title events are only expected to increase over the next 50 years, as noted in the master plan. 01:57:27
So the design you see now at 1018 is after multiple iterations of revisions. 01:57:33
With feedback from the town. 01:57:38
The Brazilians team and the neighboring properties. 01:57:40
The installation of the landscape. 01:57:45
Across the back of the property continues to follow the shape of the. 01:57:47
Critical wetland line. 01:57:50
It was pulled in 3 1/2 feet. 01:57:52
To provide a. 01:57:54
Sorry A. 01:57:58
An area for plantings and slight rating. 01:58:02
Up to. 01:58:06
To the wall between the critical limit line and the landscape wall. 01:58:07
And the top of the wall is proposed elevation 7 in order to meet that same target elevation for tidal protection. 01:58:12
That I've spoken about. 01:58:18
So what's so let me ask a question. You talked this. 01:58:21
7 foot wall. 01:58:24
The elevation of seven feet. Sorry, elevation of seven feet. 01:58:27
So, umm. 01:58:32
By more than one foot above existing grade, you're going to say anything more specific than more than one foot? 01:58:33
Does that mean you could put in 2 1/2 or 4? 01:58:41
What's What's your maximum? 01:58:46
Amount of. 01:58:48
It's right around 2 1/2 feet. 01:58:50
As shown in the presentation that Charles provided. 01:58:52
OK. That would have to limit. OK the front, right? 01:58:55
Is the lowest part of the property where the most amount of total go. 01:58:58
And how much is that? 01:59:03
I think it's a little under 2 1/2. It's over 2. 01:59:05
When at that, when we get our high tides. 01:59:08
I'm just looking at. I don't want to approve anything that says. 01:59:13
More than one foot. 01:59:17
I'll approve the less than 2 1/2 feet, but not a more than one foot. 01:59:21
Because then we have absolutely you could come in and put 5 feet on there and. 01:59:26
We would have. 01:59:31
Yeah, OK. 01:59:32
We like specificity on the Board of Zoning Appeals. 01:59:34
So you were talking about. You need to know about the. 01:59:38
Whether we can get a? 01:59:41
Approval on the fill in order to. 01:59:43
I think my words go to the next. 01:59:45
Step and that was my understanding. I could have been taking in one of our meetings of the town. My understanding was that. 01:59:47
Getting a PCA through or a PCA approval for being able to bring in. 01:59:56
Built. It's going to dictate what our final plan ends up being. 02:00:02
Do you also need to know? 02:00:06
Whether you have approval on the wall? 02:00:08
After seeing Whiteside got involved with the burn not working. 02:00:12
Our original plan. 02:00:17
Had more extensive walls that got changed. 02:00:20
The reason it juts out on the right side and comes back is because the neighbors have an existing wall. 02:00:23
That we are attempting to tie into to prevent sour. 02:00:29
Do that is why you see that line? 02:00:33
Out there. So that way we're going to have a continuous wall. 02:00:37
Microphone. 02:00:41
What is their wall made of? 02:00:44
Oh, you need to turn your microphone on. 02:00:45
Yeah, you need to be at the microphone if you're going to talk. That's my fault. I was asking you questions. 02:00:50
Just from what I can see it is masonry brick and block. 02:00:55
And. 02:01:01
There are. 02:01:03
Varying elevations of it. 02:01:05
The because it has part of it has deteriorated. 02:01:07
But that's what we're attempting to tie into that so that. 02:01:12
You know, inevitably they're going to need. 02:01:16
To address their properties in similar ways. 02:01:19
We need the continuous line kind of coming around the back to protect everybody or none of this. Does anybody any good? 02:01:23
I was not aware there was a. 02:01:32
Structure on the back of that block next to it. 02:01:35
Is it a? 02:01:38
Obviously. 02:01:41
Did we know about it? 02:01:43
Is it illegal? 02:01:44
Is it non conforming? 02:01:46
Would it be allowed to be rebuilt without coming before us? 02:01:48
Are we going to set a precedent? 02:01:52
These are all my questions. 02:01:54
We know very little about that. 02:01:56
Structure. I do see it shown on this plan. 02:01:59
But I'm yeah, I saw the jet out there and I couldn't figure out what it was for. But my guess is it predates our ordinances. 02:02:03
Oh, I'm sure it does. Yeah, yeah. 02:02:11
Old structure. 02:02:13
But I don't know. But it was still not really allowed. 02:02:15
I supposedly. 02:02:22
OK. 02:02:25
Keep going with your. 02:02:27
Proposal. 02:02:29
OK. Thank you. 02:02:31
So the. 02:02:33
The drainage improvements also include two dry wells in the back of the property. 02:02:35
With yard piping. 02:02:41
Inlets and grading to capture and retain runoff within the property, that was one of our main goals here. 02:02:42
The intent of this design is to minimize impact. 02:02:48
An additional runoff from 10/18 to either neighboring property. 02:02:51
As mentioned in the. 02:02:55
Technical memo with the application. 02:02:57
23% of 1018 Osceola Ave. 02:02:59
Currently drains towards 20/10/26. 02:03:03
To the right here. 02:03:06
And approximately 20% flows towards 1010. 02:03:07
And then after these improvements are made. 02:03:10
Those would both be reduced to 3%. 02:03:14
So that we're essentially. 02:03:16
Flow to the marsh. 02:03:17
Capturing the flow and discharging to the marsh, yes. 02:03:18
On the sidewalk on the pervious paved sidewalk on the 10:26. 02:03:22
Side of the property. 02:03:27
Will act as. 02:03:28
We have the yard analyst directly in the center of the. 02:03:30
Sidewalk and it's it's going to drain towards the back of the property instead of allowing sheet flow to run towards. 02:03:34
10/26. 02:03:40
Is that a sidewalk? 02:03:42
Gravel path? Yes. Peruse. 02:03:46
Gravel path. 02:03:47
There's no, sorry, there's no driveway that comes around the side of the property. That's just the walk pass that. 02:03:49
OK, the way it's presented it looks like. 02:03:55
It's a similar. 02:03:59
Pervious material. 02:04:01
That is. 02:04:02
Made to catch all the catch all the water diverted back to drywalls which have pumps. 02:04:05
To pump out, it's not, we're not relying just on a check valve, Right, right. OK. Yeah, yeah. 02:04:12
And so that was part of your drainage system basically. 02:04:20
And with 1010 unable to utilize a grated berm. 02:04:25
And 1026 having the existing seawall. 02:04:29
1018 would be at risk of continued. 02:04:32
Wave action between the two properties if the wall wasn't provided in the back of 10/18. 02:04:35
This will allow for a singular rigid structure between the two properties. 02:04:40
Minimizing potential future issues. 02:04:44
I'm not just concerned about the neighboring property, I'm concerned about the marsh. 02:04:46
Killing the marsh. 02:04:52
Behind a sea wall, that's what happens. 02:04:54
And Marsh is our friend. 02:04:57
Yes. 02:04:59
And the. 02:05:00
Living shoreline design that we added to 10/18. 02:05:02
There's a detail on the third sheet which. 02:05:06
Didn't end up in the presentation, but it. 02:05:08
It shows the. 02:05:10
Marsh side plantings and the grading. 02:05:12
Within town code under 1 foot. 02:05:15
Up to the base of the wall. 02:05:18
I have a print out of the plans if. 02:05:21
That will help. 02:05:23
Hold on. 02:05:24
And that was after discussions with the resilience team. 02:05:27
Right there in the bottom right, yes. 02:05:34
So. 02:05:37
And may ask just a general question so. 02:05:50
We're talking about these two properties, but we've identified. 02:05:54
Sort of 14 properties that are sort of in a similar situation. 02:05:57
Tell us what the downside is to the other. 02:06:04
Adjacent 12 parcels if there isn't a wall that continues along there. 02:06:07
Is there a downside? 02:06:13
This wall wouldn't. 02:06:15
Produce any. 02:06:16
Additional flood risks for the neighboring properties to the to the. 02:06:18
Northeast. 02:06:23
14 other properties. 02:06:24
They would have to produce the lot level improvements similar to 10:10 and 10:18. 02:06:25
To prevent the. 02:06:30
Flood risks moving forward. 02:06:32
Presumably if. 02:06:37
We did this. 02:06:39
We would get 12 other. 02:06:41
Applications. 02:06:43
Yeah. 02:06:45
That's the problem. 02:06:47
And when that happens? 02:06:51
I don't care how much you try and mitigate. 02:06:53
Having planting. 02:06:56
The tide is still going to take that, I mean. 02:06:58
Yeah, yeah. But that lot's going to be unusual. 02:07:02
We would have to make. We would have. 02:07:07
Yeah, we. 02:07:10
Yes, 1010 is going to be unusable. 02:07:12
And 10:18 should maybe be protected to help 10/10. 02:07:16
But we, we would, if we approve this, we would have to be really, really specific about. 02:07:21
There's no other No2 lots next to each other like this we're. 02:07:27
Well, yeah, because, because if we approve a. 02:07:32
Call it a. 02:07:37
Landscape wall or whatever, it's a seawall if we approve that. 02:07:38
Everybody else is going to want one. 02:07:44
That's that's. 02:07:46
And so we have to and so if we approve it. 02:07:48
Which I'm not inclined to approve it right now. I'm more inclined to approve some fill. 02:07:51
That's capped. 02:07:57
So that the flooding can get mitigated. 02:08:00
The current flooding can get mitigated on the on basically on the front specifically for. 02:08:04
Miss Muellers lot. 02:08:09
But that's. 02:08:11
Yeah, Miss Miller's 10/10. 02:08:13
That's the little, the little historic. She can't move it. She can't. 02:08:15
Raise it. She can't do anything with it. We may be able to raise it, but with it being on the National Register, you are extremely 02:08:18
limited on what you. 02:08:23
Are allowed to do, yeah. 02:08:28
And plus the size of that how it's, it's a historic cottage and you couldn't raise it up to we do permit elevation of historic 02:08:29
properties. We do allow for the elevation of historic properties to protect them from flood. 02:08:36
Yeah. 02:08:44
Also, I think it's important to note that. 02:08:46
The town is very close to completion of their resiliency. 02:08:50
And sea level rise adaptation plan which will be complete with strategies to address. 02:08:55
Problems that are currently before this board. 02:09:00
And that is supposed to be going to the council for a vote for final approval in July. 02:09:04
I don't understand what that means. Something that is going to fix this? 02:09:10
Something to. 02:09:14
Give. 02:09:16
Owners a playbook of strategies that the town will hope to change ordinances in order to. 02:09:17
Improve the opportunities for people to address problems like that. 02:09:25
Yes. 02:09:29
I have a question for you, I'm sorry. 02:09:30
Want to interrupt for a second? 02:09:33
If we were not. 02:09:34
To approve this today. 02:09:37
And it turns out that. 02:09:40
Raising the street level. 02:09:43
Significantly impacts these lots. 02:09:45
Would it be a bar for them to reapply? 02:09:47
Based on. 02:09:52
The actual impact of raising the. 02:09:53
The streets. 02:09:56
The street in front. 02:09:58
They couldn't come back with the exact same request. 02:10:00
They what They would not be able to come back with the exact same request if they were denied. 02:10:04
But a? 02:10:09
Variation of this request, but that seems to put them in the position of. 02:10:11
US saying. 02:10:16
You can't. 02:10:18
Do what you want to do because the. 02:10:19
Increase in the level of the street is likely not to impact you. 02:10:23
And then increasing the level of this. 02:10:26
Of this street. 02:10:30
Pretty clearly to me, indicates that's going to. 02:10:32
Add water to that lot. 02:10:35
It may not add the footprint of the water. 02:10:37
But if you raise this street, what is how many feet? 02:10:40
2 or 1 1/2 feet? How many? 02:10:44
1 1/2 feet, so 1 1/2 feet. And does that go into the right of way as well or just the? 02:10:47
The street itself. What do you do with the right away when you raise the street like that? 02:10:52
The sorry, I thought that before. 02:10:56
The right away would be regraded. 02:10:59
Yeah, to blend with the the new elevation of the roadway. 02:11:02
And large pipes are proposed underneath the driveways. 02:11:06
And there's a there's a large. 02:11:10
Check Valve. 02:11:13
Proposed on the corner of 10/10. 02:11:15
That would prevent. 02:11:17
Water, uh. 02:11:18
From getting up. 02:11:20
That drainage ditch? 02:11:21
But the the flooding, the elevation based flooding would still occur from the back of the property. Yeah, raising the street is 02:11:23
not going to. 02:11:27
Increase the flooding. It's the tidal flooding. 02:11:32
For that one, because we can't raise the street and inundate somebody'd. 02:11:35
We have to have our own. 02:11:39
Stormwater mitigation if we're going to raise the street so. 02:11:42
Yes, hers is from Tidal, definitely. 02:11:46
If I could offer a couple of points. 02:11:49
We the changes that were made to this plan. 02:11:52
In the last go round where after meeting with the resiliency team. 02:11:56
The reason the wall was moved back three feet was. 02:12:00
Doctor Elko, who was, he's on the resiliency team, said that that was. 02:12:05
One of the things that she thought would help. 02:12:09
The reason that the wall stops where it is on the right hand side of the property is because. 02:12:11
They told us that one of the things they were going to propose was that you were allowed to do things within that 30 foot OCR in 02:12:17
set back, which is why that wall stops at 30 feet. 02:12:21
Because we were told that. 02:12:26
That's what is going to be put forward to town now. The town hasn't accepted it yet, but that's. 02:12:29
That was the direction they were going. 02:12:33
That was why this plan was done. 02:12:36
In kind of coordination with the resiliency team. 02:12:40
Umm. 02:12:44
And one of the things that came up with the drainage. 02:12:46
In the future. 02:12:51
Is that by raising the grade? 02:12:53
The pipes that have to be put in for drain for draining. 02:12:56
The way it is currently have to be so deep that they're almost rendered ineffective without having some type of an additional pump 02:13:01
system. 02:13:05
So by doing this great, assuming everybody on on that that. 02:13:10
I think it's Sea Breeze Lane. Everything on the southern side of Sea Breeze Lane were to do the same. 02:13:14
That would actually help with the drainage infrastructure in the future. 02:13:19
And to your point about not wanting to approve grade over a certain over 1 foot or whatever. 02:13:24
What if we set that by the grade? 02:13:32
So it's not necessarily 1 foot 2 foot. What if it's you can grade up to? 02:13:35
6 foot 5 or up to whatever. 02:13:41
You all think is best and in that way the people that already have higher properties. 02:13:44
You know they're not going to need to bring in as much fill. 02:13:48
If their elevation is at 6 foot and not. 02:13:51
You know, 4 1/2 year or whatever. I don't know if that's a potential. 02:13:55
Middle ground kind of a thing, not the way the. 02:14:00
The zoning ordinances set out right now for our approval, who is the resiliency team because I don't think it's staff. Staff has 02:14:03
not seen this. 02:14:09
Because you've referenced them a couple of times, but I I know. 02:14:18
It's Kim. 02:14:21
Something Stafford and Brown Is it the consultants? The consultants? 02:14:24
But it's not the staff, the staff. 02:14:28
I mean, we did meet with the staff and go over the plan. 02:14:31
That's not that we're talking about the. 02:14:34
Consultants, don't you think? 02:14:37
I mean. 02:14:41
Not here to give you advice, certainly, but. 02:14:42
Don't you think it would be a safer play to? 02:14:45
Postpone your. 02:14:48
Application until you find out what the resilience committee. 02:14:49
Is going to do and what you and you know whether or not the. 02:14:53
The streets going to be raised and what the impacts are going to have. 02:14:58
Rather than have us. 02:15:02
Vote, vote on this and have you barred. 02:15:06
From doing the exact same plan even if it becomes feasible in the future. So we did talk about that. 02:15:09
We feel, we feel pretty confident based on the communication between Semen Whiteside and the resilience and team, that what we're 02:15:18
doing is going to fall in the parameters of what they're going to present. 02:15:22
We're faced with the dilemma of we're under construction right now. We have the ability to come in and do all of this work now and 02:15:28
be proactive. 02:15:32
Planning for the future? 02:15:37
As opposed to. 02:15:39
You know, if we have to come in and raise this grade, then all the landscaping, all the drainage, the hardscape, all of that stuff 02:15:41
that would be done. 02:15:45
Would essentially have to be taken out and redone. 02:15:50
Which is a, you know, substantial cost to the homeowner at that point to basically redo. 02:15:53
You know, as far as we are concerned. 02:15:57
This is what Sullivan's Island is going to do. This is what the town is telling us they're going to do. 02:16:01
With this with this master plan. 02:16:05
Now the the the timeline and all that stuff, I understand that is up in the air. We don't know. 02:16:08
But. 02:16:12
If this happens in two years. 02:16:13
We did this work now. 02:16:16
Knowing that this was going to happen. 02:16:18
And then it's a substantial. 02:16:21
You know, for Mr. Abbasold and the homeowners at that point. 02:16:24
Are you really making this application because of what's going to happen in the future with the town or are you making this 02:16:27
application because what's going on right now? It was both. 02:16:32
To be honest, it was. 02:16:37
Mostly to do what was happening now, but done to work with what the town will do in the future. 02:16:40
Well, do you have any evidence of what the town is going to do in the future is going to negatively impact? 02:16:47
Because what I've heard is it's not. 02:16:52
I mean this the semen whitesides own master plan says that. 02:16:54
You have that the town needs to allow. 02:16:58
These property owners to address their properties because they're not. 02:17:01
It's not addressed inside of their plan. I mean, no, no, no. I get that part. What I what? 02:17:05
What? I don't know that matters, but. 02:17:10
These folks are saying what we're going to do is not going to impact your life. It's not going to get better. 02:17:14
It's not going to negatively, it's not gonna make it worse. 02:17:18
And y'all aren't saying what? You don't have evidence that what the town's gonna do is gonna make it worse. You're just saying 02:17:21
it's not gonna help. 02:17:24
Right. 02:17:27
Yeah, yeah, flooding the worst. 02:17:30
Regardless of what they do. 02:17:31
Well, I would also counter that the town is protecting everybody but these 14 property owners by that. 02:17:33
When you look at that, you also when you look at the plan and you look at the protection that Raising Osceola gives all the other 02:17:39
property owners. 02:17:42
They're all being taken care of, but by virtue of us being on the Marsh side of Osceola, these 14 property owners are excluded. 02:17:45
From that. 02:17:52
What stage of construction are you currently in on 2/18? 02:17:54
10/18. 02:17:58
We are final. I mean it's the BZA were to grant approval, the surveyor would be there next week staking out so that we could get 02:17:59
started. 02:18:04
We are currently scheduled to be completed in September. 02:18:09
Do you need this landscaping? 02:18:17
I probably should know this, but even if the landscaping plan or whatever you're going to do has to be approved for you get see 02:18:20
it. 02:18:23
Yes, before we start doing it, we need to get town's blessing on it. 02:18:25
We were trying to. 02:18:30
Get this so that we could do that. 02:18:31
I'm just struggling a little bit to meet the requirements. 02:18:40
That we have to meet to grant variance is. 02:18:44
That you really can't use the property. 02:18:47
The way you want to. You know you can't. 02:18:50
Make real use of the property. 02:18:53
And it sounds like what's the size of the structure you're building on the on 10/18? 02:18:55
How many square feet? 02:19:00
Oh, it's 4200 and change heated square feet. I think that doesn't seem like that's a real restriction on your. 02:19:02
Use of the. 02:19:09
Of the property. To counter that, you can't even get to the property. 02:19:10
And why are you building there? 02:19:13
A Literally. 02:19:15
Walking and driving through the 12 inch of water on the driveway at hot. 02:19:17
I mean I I I have to wear my big boots because if I wear my regular boat shoes the water is over top of it. 02:19:22
On at hot tubs, not every day. 02:19:28
I'm on my 4th temporary power pole because the at high tides the water is so high it floods my temporary power pole at that front 02:19:31
right corner over 2 feet. 02:19:35
Part of this is if this is a plan approved. 02:19:42
Dominion needs to raise the transformer that is at that corner of the property because it has flooded so many times. 02:19:44
That the internals of it have been corroded. 02:19:52
I'm continually having problems just keeping power on the House because of that. 02:19:56
Have you looked at damage to the marsh as a result of the wall? 02:20:02
Have you investigated that there's been? 02:20:06
Statements that it's going to damage the. 02:20:09
I guess the way you deal with the runoff is going to damage the marsh like y'all looked into that. 02:20:12
I mean, I would assume RCA would make you do that. 02:20:17
I would part of the reason that the resiliency team. 02:20:20
Is proposing the the landscape or I'm sorry, the living living shoreline was what they called it. 02:20:26
The reason that that was being proposed, and I'll have to let Kevin talk to the science aspect of it, was that the assumption was 02:20:32
that that that helped prevent that from the way of action. 02:20:37
I I think the marsh is going to do what the marsh is going to do. You know, you can't fight back the ocean. 02:20:44
You can protect yourself as much as you can, but. 02:20:50
This is at an extreme. 02:20:54
Flood event? You know all bets are off, right? 02:20:58
But this isn't about the extreme, this is about the. 02:21:01
The typical. 02:21:04
You know, umm. 02:21:06
More than a dozen times a year, that. 02:21:07
You are, you're on and out. Your house is on an island and that's what happens with with Mary's property. Are you saying you get 02:21:10
title? 02:21:14
Flooding in the front of the lot. 02:21:17
Every single time there's a hot tide. 02:21:20
It wraps the property. 02:21:23
It gets on the Kilpatrick's property and part of the problem is it gets there and it gets stuck. 02:21:25
So we actually have already at the beginning of construction it was such a problem. 02:21:29
We regraded the front of our property and the front of 10/10. 02:21:34
To allow the water to get out because it would get into the front of. 02:21:38
1018 Osceola and it was trash. 02:21:42
This was an existing condition when. 02:21:55
The house was. 02:21:58
Torn down and a replacement house was built. 02:22:00
That was obviously an existing condition. 02:22:03
Of this lot. So we're just getting this now. 02:22:06
When the house is. 02:22:10
Being built. 02:22:12
I have a problem with that. 02:22:14
Umm. 02:22:17
You, I mean, you're not you, you, you got, you must have gotten some. Go back to that. 02:22:22
DRB must have granted you some. 02:22:30
Because the house isn't some of the does have. 02:22:34
This incursion into some of the setbacks. So it's a very large house. That is actually not what we built though. 02:22:38
We did not use that variance because. 02:22:45
So this isn't even existing. Well. Well, we did not take advantage of the variance that we were granted for the sod set back to 02:22:49
get into the set back. But but you moved the house over to accommodate the neighbors. 02:22:55
Got it. But you still are building, what would you say 4600 square foot house? 02:23:00
On a lot that floods. 02:23:05
It was an existing condition. 02:23:08
That you should have asked for mitigation at the beginning, not and you're asking for it at the end and so. 02:23:10
We feel a little. 02:23:15
Constrained. 02:23:18
You might say. 02:23:19
At least I do. 02:23:24
Charles, can I ask you a question, do you think? 02:23:26
The resiliency. 02:23:28
Committee or report? 02:23:31
Will say something smart to you, like when I look at the. 02:23:33
Cross section of the. 02:23:36
Of what's proposed as a landscape wall. 02:23:38
I'm an architect by nature and you know the concrete section to do that. 02:23:44
And to have it withstand. 02:23:49
What it has to withstand? 02:23:52
There's a pretty big impact and I don't think it's. 02:23:55
Pressure treated. 02:23:57
6 by sixes. 02:23:59
Either and it leaves. 02:24:00
US in a really bad place because we don't know what we're approving. 02:24:03
You know there's no. 02:24:06
So so we have we have an option. 02:24:09
That we can do. We actually did this at the last meeting. 02:24:11
We do have an option of tabling this. 02:24:15
And asking you. 02:24:18
To go back and do a deeper dive, not with the resiliency team, but with our actual town staff. 02:24:20
Our resiliency officer and our zoning administrator and our building inspector and that is really what I would like to see. 02:24:26
Especially. 02:24:33
Because we're going to be having some things go before town council. 02:24:34
That might even mitigate y'all even having to come to us. 02:24:39
I don't know. 02:24:42
I mean, you say you're going to finish in September. 02:24:43
I don't think another month. 02:24:46
Would limit you that much. I'm sorry that you've waited until the end of the project. 02:24:50
But I really feel that our town staff, who are our own experts. 02:24:55
Need to look at this because. 02:25:00
They have not recommended approval of this based on what they've seen. You've worked with the resiliency team. That's not our 02:25:02
staff. 02:25:06
And as far as the BCA? 02:25:10
Our due diligence is listening not only to you. 02:25:13
And to your engineers, but. 02:25:16
To our staff who deal with these issues all the time. 02:25:18
So that's actually. 02:25:22
My preference as to what we would do. 02:25:25
We I don't want to deny you. 02:25:29
But based on the information before me. 02:25:31
I have no other choice. 02:25:34
Based on exactly what you're asking for, or I would have to put so many contingencies on it. 02:25:35
That it would be unusable to you. 02:25:40
We want you to be able to mitigate. 02:25:42
Flooding. 02:25:46
Umm, we're not in the business of approving. We have never. 02:25:48
Approved a seawall. 02:25:53
We will be setting a precedent that we would have to make sure that we were not setting a precedent. 02:25:54
The fill I get. 02:25:59
But I really would prefer. 02:26:02
Tabling it. 02:26:05
If you're, I mean. 02:26:07
You don't get a vote on what we do. 02:26:09
You know, if we table it, it's not because we don't want you to be able to protect these two properties. 02:26:13
It's because we want our town staff to be able to look at it and work with you, not just a resiliency team. 02:26:18
That are the town's consultants who haven't received approval of their work. 02:26:25
By the town council. 02:26:29
Obviously we would prefer that over denial. 02:26:33
Yeah. Oh, I don't want to deny you at all. 02:26:36
Just just for clarification, we have met with Charles and Max. We did not meet with, I'm sorry, I don't know your name, the towns 02:26:39
resiliency Rebecca. 02:26:43
She's in charge of all of our plants and trees. So we have, she's a very important person for this one. You know, we, we met. 02:26:48
With Max and Charles. 02:26:56
The architect and I have. 02:26:58
I know that Semen Whiteside has had some discussion with them. I don't want to make it seem like we didn't include them at all. 02:27:00
Also, it was my impression that in the packet it called that out as a wood wall. If not, that is an error on us that we can we can 02:27:06
correct. But it is you know what, you know what it says in your application? A fence made of materials other than wood or metal. 02:27:14
An offense without any openings across its plane. 02:27:24
Reference the variance. 02:27:27
OK, I have a question too. How many? 02:27:33
Days or. 02:27:36
What does the tide have to reach to make it so that? 02:27:38
It is impassable for you to. 02:27:43
Reach the property. 02:27:45
I would say anytime the tide is over. 02:27:50
I don't know how it's Dean too. We think five and a half, six feet. It's probably up in. 02:27:54
See if it's if it's. If it ties at 6 1/2, the Todd is over our slab. 02:27:59
So it's not, it's not a 6 1/2 foot tide washes over the entire thing. 02:28:04
If it is. 02:28:09
The road is at 4.5 and change so if it's a 5 foot tide. 02:28:11
You have 6 inches of you have more than 6 inches of water because our driveway is less than that. 02:28:17
Umm, so I would say. 02:28:21
I would say A5 foot tide makes it makes it so. 02:28:24
Anything greater than that? 02:28:29
It comes up at 6 1/2. 02:28:31
You know you're from. 02:28:33
From when I tore down the house. 02:28:35
To October in 2023, I had five storm events that had water. 02:28:37
Across the property I had photos where you can't even see the land. 02:28:44
From the storms, so when you get the bigger. 02:28:47
Fall hurricanes and storms. 02:28:50
You know, again, you're not going to stop that and prevent that. 02:28:53
But on the normal high tides when you get a six foot tide or a 6 1/2 foot tide. 02:28:56
The the driveway area at the front where it backs up is underwater. 02:29:01
Would it be helpful? 02:29:11
It's more information. 02:29:13
Sure. Yeah. I have a question. When you say that the Osceola side of the property is inaccessible, is that because the ditch is 02:29:20
backing up with water? 02:29:25
From the tide. 02:29:31
From the tide and isn't it true that. 02:29:32
One of the minor improvement projects that's that the town is currently already pursuing through the skip grant funding will be. 02:29:34
Check Valve. 02:29:42
At the outlet of that, ditch that. 02:29:44
Allow it not to fill with tidal water. 02:29:47
I don't know, but I would assume so, yes. 02:29:50
But I would counter that by saying that if you don't raise the grade around that, it doesn't do any good because it's going to 02:29:52
come right around it. 02:29:56
Right, and the ditch is lower than the yard, isn't it? Yes, it's a ditch. The ditch in front of 10/10 basically just stays full of 02:29:59
water. 02:30:03
It does flow and when the tide comes in it backs up in front of 10/18 goes up. 02:30:10
Right, and these are semen and whitesides stormwater plan improvements, right? You separated out the raising of the road from. 02:30:14
The check valve on the outlet. 02:30:21
Of that drainage pipe. 02:30:26
And then I feel like I'm missing one other sort of minor improvement to that system that would happen on a much quicker timeline 02:30:28
and mitigate a lot of the flooding around in that neighborhood. 02:30:34
And at a much quicker timeframe than raising the road at Osceola. Is that what you recall from the stormwater plan? 02:30:40
For you guys in the normal course of business. 02:30:51
Discussion at the office in order to you do gain some more information. 02:30:59
Then we can come back and we reserve. 02:31:03
Exactly. 02:31:05
And when do you expect to have the resilience? 02:31:08
I just love that the resilience committee it sounds. 02:31:13
Anyway, when is the resilience? 02:31:16
Consultant, their committee going to come back. 02:31:19
Recommendations. Are there options? Do you know that? 02:31:22
It's the third Tuesday of July will be when it's presented to council. 02:31:25
For the final draft is presented to Council cumulatively, don't you think it would be helpful? 02:31:31
Contract for the property owners to the city, our town. 02:31:39
To have that information to see if they can problem solve. 02:31:43
Yes. And we met with the resilience. 02:31:46
Consultants on Tuesday of this week to discuss. 02:31:50
What the recommendations might be? What? 02:31:54
For ordinance amendments that. 02:31:57
Will address these. 02:32:00
You know, low elevation lots and the concerns for them. 02:32:03
And are working through. 02:32:07
But have not completed. 02:32:09
The study that we need to do in order to. 02:32:12
Provide those recommendations for ordinance changes and we're working with the Planning Commission currently kind of prepping them 02:32:14
for. 02:32:17
What's to come on that front? OK, And would have a better understanding of what? 02:32:21
We might be able to do with these two locks. 02:32:25
Correct there. It may be that there. 02:32:29
Be a requirement for a variance. 02:32:32
A design that's very similar to this. 02:32:35
James Yeah, I'd like to make a lecture that we. 02:32:39
Table the variance requests for 10/10 oscillator. 02:32:42
On the other island in 1018, Osceola Ave. 02:32:47
To give. 02:32:50
The amount of time to have further discussions with the town. 02:32:52
And then? 02:32:56
Bring it back in July, probably. 02:32:59
Probably been. 02:33:03
That's OK, They can still bring it back. In July we will have. 02:33:04
My the the most. 02:33:08
Important thing. 02:33:10
Is and I second that. 02:33:11
The most important thing is for the three of you. 02:33:13
To be able to sit down with their team. 02:33:17
Rebecca knows what we're actually doing. 02:33:20
And what, what might impact but. 02:33:23
I need y'all's eyes on this. 02:33:26
We need your eyes on this project and more. 02:33:28
Specific. 02:33:31
I I'm sorry that we have to consider tabling this. We're going to vote on it in a minute. 02:33:32
But. 02:33:38
We feel like we're getting it at the last minute. 02:33:39
And the variances that are being requested. 02:33:43
Are quite substantial. 02:33:46
And. 02:33:48
Way out of the ordinary. 02:33:50
So that's why. 02:33:51
It's our due diligence to make sure we're making the best decision, and we don't have enough information to do that. 02:33:53
So I will call for a vote on favor of tabling all in favor of the motion to table. Please signify by saying aye aye. 02:33:59
No opposition this and when I I did have. 02:34:08
A question before Oh, OK, before I vote. 02:34:14
Do you think July is really enough time as opposed to August? 02:34:18
That's fine. No? Plenty of time. 02:34:21
The last one was tabled and brought back in a month, I know, but we didn't have an intervening council vote that well, no, no, I 02:34:24
don't think we need, I don't think we need a council vote. What I'm really more concerned about is that. 02:34:30
Our resiliency officer has the ability to look at this. 02:34:37
In the context of what is actually happening, because evidently things are happening. 02:34:41
And I said I thought August 2, but Rebecca. 02:34:47
Said I could have some discussion. 02:34:51
Fruitful discussions between male and July, Yeah. 02:34:53
They know what they know what they're working on. They just had a meeting this week, so. 02:34:56
OK. Can your vote stay? Yeah. OK. 02:35:01
I didn't say anything, OK, but yes, now. 02:35:04
So that approved, it is tabled and we'll come back in July and now we have one more. 02:35:06
Excuse me, Yes. 02:35:12
Yes, I'm. 02:35:14
1026 off yellow on the other side of the Yes Sir. 02:35:16
Waiting here for a while. Glad you tangled it and I wondered if I could just say a couple. 02:35:21
It's related. 02:35:27
To moving forward. 02:35:29
Yes. Can you keep it very short and you need to go to the microphone. We have a member that's on a short break, just requested a 02:35:32
short break. So he's OK. Well, I'm going to let him talk while he's not here. 02:35:38
All right. My name is Dean Kilpatrick. I've lived at 1026 Osceola. 02:35:43
For 50 years. 02:35:48
And have seen the tides rise and the flooding and all of that. 02:35:50
I do think that the. 02:35:55
Those houses, the three houses that are adjacent. 02:35:57
Really do need some help. And it's not, you know, if you've got huge tidal flooding, that's one thing. 02:36:02
But I mean, just regular rain coming off. And if you raise Osceola, something needs to be done. 02:36:08
So we're supportive of most of what they want to do. We would just like to be included in discussions. 02:36:14
So because really, you know, if you raise the grade more on that lot. 02:36:20
The water goes someplace, and if you raise the street, the water goes someplace. 02:36:26
So we would like to work together to get a common solution for it, but it really is a problem. Yes, as part of any. 02:36:32
Agreement to add fill to a lot they have to provide drainage program drainage plans so that it would not they have they have 02:36:41
reached out on that which I want to you know give them credit for and our house is. 02:36:48
Actually, not on the historic register, but we want to talk about it being because it was there in 1890. 02:36:55
So at any rate, we just want to work together. So thank you. 02:37:02
OK. 02:37:06
I think we're at the end. 02:37:10
Oh my God. 02:37:12
OK, we have an special exception request. Historic Accessory Dwelling Unit, 1914 Central Ave. 02:37:14
Approval of special exception for the historic structure on the property to be used in accessory dwelling unit in accordance with 02:37:22
Zoning Ordinance Sections 2120, C 2. 02:37:26
And 21178 Charles please present for the town. 02:37:30
Thank you. I'm so sorry. 02:37:33
That you had to sit through this entire meeting. 02:37:35
I'm sure Amber was riveted the entire time. 02:37:38
So yes, this is a 1914 Central Ave. The request is for the special exception to allow the historic. 02:37:43
Cottage on the lot to remain and become an accessory dwelling unit with a new home to be built also in another location on the 02:37:51
lot. 02:37:55
This is the property outlined in yellow and a couple of photographs of the. 02:38:01
Existing college. 02:38:05
Here's an aerial of the property. 02:38:08
And then a posting on the property advertising the meeting tonight. 02:38:11
And. 02:38:15
For the record, this was. 02:38:17
Added to our historic registry. 02:38:18
In April. 02:38:22
In the in the last couple of months. 02:38:26
And it had been previously recommended in the 2007 Snyder survey, but not. 02:38:30
Formally designated. 02:38:37
And so we're happy to have this. 02:38:39
Little Cottage added to our historic designation list. You can see from the. 02:38:42
Christina Butler report that was presented to the Design Review Board when it was. 02:38:48
Designated historic, this was the original the form of it in the. 02:38:54
1930. 02:39:00
8 uh. 02:39:02
Sanborn. 02:39:05
Probably wrong on that date and I apologize but. 02:39:07
Early Sanborn map shows it. 02:39:10
With a little front porch. 02:39:13
Rectangular body with a little. 02:39:15
Appendage off to the side and so. 02:39:17
Overtime there's been a porch added to the side. The front porch has been removed in an entry entry stairway. 02:39:20
Added there and then there was some expansion on the back to have these. 02:39:28
Several rooms. 02:39:32
So the proposal is to bring it back to this. 02:39:34
Size, which is under 1200 square feet, meeting the requirements of the special exception. 02:39:37
And. 02:39:46
Per the board's request, we have a. 02:39:47
Formal site plan for the proposal. So this is the existing site plan on the property. 02:39:51
With a non historic shed in the rear. 02:39:57
The proposed. 02:40:00
Redesigned cottage would not be elevated or moved from its current location. 02:40:02
A new pool would separate it from the new construction that would fit within the setbacks of the property. 02:40:08
As required by the special exception. 02:40:15
Rules. 02:40:18
Just a little background, it was March 19th. 02:40:20
And the board gave conceptual approval. 02:40:23
For removing the non historic conditions and. 02:40:26
Prove the structures of traditional island resource. 02:40:29
Again, that would return the cottage to under 1200 square feet, making it eligible for this special exception under section 02:40:33
21C2120C2 of the zoning ordinance. 02:40:38
That was the 38th Sanborn map. The current college square footage is 1479. 02:40:45
With the removals of the non historic additions it will be 1183 square feet. 02:40:51
And the new construction is proposed to mostly be a one story elevated home. 02:40:57
On the rear of the property, with small yard and pool separating it from the historic cottage. 02:41:03
Staff recommends approval of the special exception according to DRB approval and provided that the Board makes findings of fact 02:41:09
that the project complies with the standards for granting special exceptions found in section 21178. 02:41:16
Those findings of fact need to be that there is adequate provision made for such items as setbacks, fences. 02:41:23
And buffered planting strips to protect adjacent properties from possible adverse influence of the proposed use. 02:41:30
Such as noise, vibration, dust, glare, odor, traffic congestion, and similar factors. 02:41:36
Really, this meets the setback requirements and. 02:41:43
Is a single family use in a single family district so. 02:41:48
Most of that is. 02:41:52
Not particularly germane. 02:41:53
Vehicular traffic and pedestrian movement on adjacent roads will not be hindered or endangered. 02:41:57
They'll use the same access point. 02:42:04
From Central. 02:42:08
From Central Ave. that is currently used for the. 02:42:09
Historic Cottage. 02:42:13
That that road would be extended so that off street parking and loading areas and entrances and negatives of these areas are 02:42:15
adequate in terms of location, amount, design and construction to serve the proposed use. 02:42:21
So the driver would be extended to serve both of the homes. 02:42:27
The proposed use should be compatible with the existing uses to the extent. 02:42:31
That such use will not adversely affect the level of property values, general character or general welfare of the nearby area. 02:42:36
Again, they're just proposing to place a new home in the backyard. 02:42:44
Fairly large lot. 02:42:49
So it's also. 02:42:55
Important to note that. 02:42:58
There's ownership requirement for these special exceptions, so it must remain at a 4% tax. 02:43:00
With the Charleston County. 02:43:09
Assessor's Office. 02:43:11
Meaning that there's owner occupied in one of the units. 02:43:13
And. 02:43:17
Other considerations of the structure being under 1200 have been met. 02:43:19
That I'll ask if you all have any questions or turn it over to the applicant. 02:43:25
Nope. 02:43:30
Would you like to have? 02:43:32
Present. 02:43:34
Charles, am I able to drive or will I just? 02:43:37
Yes, Oh no. And I'll ask you to advance us to some slides. 02:43:41
I gotcha. So my name is Amber Ahmed and I prepared the submittal. I drew the renovation to the cottage as well as the proposed 02:43:45
primary structure in the back. 02:43:51
If you'll take us to C1 or C2. 02:43:58
Here we are so just reiterating what Charles told you. We found the evidence from the Sanborn map. 02:44:03
That the original form of the cottage was just a simple Gable with a full width front porch. 02:44:10
And it always had the little appendage on the rear left corner. 02:44:16
So we had Christina Butler, historic preservationist. 02:44:22
In town, prepare. 02:44:26
A historic report for us as well and her found her findings rather. 02:44:29
Corroborated that Sanborn. 02:44:34
Footprint in terms of? 02:44:37
Historic form and materials. So we took that to the DRB. They approved. 02:44:39
The cottage to be. 02:44:45
Added to the historic inventory on the island. 02:44:47
Such that we removed all. 02:44:51
All of the extraneous additions that have been added over time will you take us to? 02:44:53
A or the. 02:45:00
Demo plan. 02:45:01
So you can see what would be removed. 02:45:04
Additionally, there are two water oaks. 02:45:09
A pecan and a Birch that is going in front of the tree Commission. 02:45:12
To make way for the proposed primary structure in the back. 02:45:16
And if you'll take us to the next slide. 02:45:20
Yeah, this is a nicely treed lot too. So the is going to be completely hidden. That's exactly right. In fact, to your point, if 02:45:24
you'll take us back to the contextual images in the front. 02:45:29
This is so nicely nestled. You can see there central. I mean it is veiled from the streetscape. 02:45:37
So it will it will be difficult to see a larger structure looming behind it. 02:45:45
And so. 02:45:52
You know we just tried to play within all the parameters of the special exception. 02:45:54
The cottage meets all the requirements and then the primary structure. 02:45:59
Would meet all of the ordinances as well, so. 02:46:04
OK. 02:46:08
Don't have any questions. 02:46:10
OK. Thanks for giving us an easy one. 02:46:13
We should have slipped it in the middle. Maybe. Maybe we should have. 02:46:18
OK. 02:46:27
All righty. Well, I have I have absolutely no questions. I love. 02:46:29
I do love the special exception even though. 02:46:34
Because it does preserve. I grew up on this island and it does preserve all the. 02:46:38
Small colleges. 02:46:43
That give the eclectic feel they've always been small cottages and big houses on this island. 02:46:44
So I just. 02:46:50
I really like your plan. I do know you have to go to the tree Commission but. 02:46:51
But you have plenty of other trees on this property, so. 02:46:56
I don't think I don't think that's going to be a problem. 02:46:59
Maybe I shouldn't say that. 02:47:02
But but yeah, I really. 02:47:04
I love the. 02:47:08
Of the design. 02:47:10
Yeah. 02:47:11
Make a motion. Yes, you may make a motion. 02:47:14
I don't think we have to discuss this. 02:47:16
Unless our architect has something to say. 02:47:18
Yeah, it's yeah, yeah. 02:47:21
All right, I'll make a motion that we grant the applicants request. 02:47:24
For approval of a special exception for the historic structure. 02:47:28
On the property to be used as an accessory dwelling unit. 02:47:32
In accordance with the zoning ordinance. 02:47:36
21-20C. 02:47:40
Open paren to close paren. 02:47:42
And 21-17. 02:47:45
Eight in that. 02:47:48
So let's see, we found that there's adequate provision made. 02:47:50
For items such as setbacks, fences. 02:47:54
And buffered or planting strips to protect. 02:47:58
Adjacent properties from. 02:48:01
Possible adverse influence. 02:48:02
Of the proposed use, such as noise, vibration, dust, glare, odor, traffic congestion, and similar factors #2 vehicular traffic and 02:48:04
pedestrian movement on adjacent roads shall not be hindered or. 02:48:11
Endangered 3 off street parking and loading areas and the entrance and exits. 02:48:17
Of these areas will be adequate in terms of location, amount, design and construction to serve the. 02:48:22
Proposed use. 02:48:29
The use, it appears based on the evidence, will be compatible with existing uses to the extent that such use will not adversely 02:48:31
affect both. 02:48:35
Level of property values, general character or general? 02:48:40
Welfare of nearby area. 02:48:43
Is there a second second? 02:48:46
All in favor signify by saying aye aye, like sign opposed. The special exception is granted. 02:48:48
And. 02:48:54
This meeting is adjourned. 02:48:56
Get out of here. 02:48:58
It's not our longest. 02:49:00
But it's. 02:49:02
Pretty close, good to see you. 02:49:03
Yeah. 02:49:06
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Transcript
Like to call this meeting of the Board of Zoning Appeals to order. 00:00:07
I'm Bridget. Have the Freedom of Information Act requirements been met? 00:00:10
Thank you. 00:00:14
Announcements before we start. If you have a cell phone, take it out. 00:00:16
And put it on silent. 00:00:21
Or turn it off. 00:00:23
Also, there is no crosstalk. 00:00:28
This is a quasi judicial hearing. It is being recorded. 00:00:31
And it is appealable, the decisions and so. 00:00:35
All comments. When you make comments during public comment, you're making them. 00:00:39
To the board. 00:00:44
You are not asking questions of any of the applicants. 00:00:45
Hope everybody understands that. 00:00:49
I will gavel you out of order if you cross talk. 00:00:52
So. 00:00:55
Now ask for approval of the minutes from the May 8th meeting. 00:00:57
Have. I don't think there were any comments or changes. 00:01:01
OK. Do I hear a motion for approval? 00:01:05
Much different than that James made the motion. 00:01:08
2nd. 00:01:13
All in favor signify by saying aye. 00:01:14
Like sign opposed, the minutes are approved. 00:01:16
The first item. 00:01:18
Oh my. 00:01:21
The first item is a variance request 12 by 4 middle St. 00:01:23
Any favor architects? 00:01:28
Variances from 2120 C 3A to allow two buildings on one lot. 2125 B to increase the principal building coverage on the lot. 00:01:30
Beyond the maximum allowable 2126 B to allow the impervious coverage beyond the maximum. 00:01:37
2127 B to increase the principal building square footage beyond the maximum allowable and 2123 F. 00:01:43
And 2122 C one and three to reduce the required side yard set back and eliminate the side facade requirements. 00:01:49
To replace the existing parish hall on the Stella Marist Church campus in accordance with Zoning Ordinance 21179. 00:01:57
Charles, will you please present for the town? 00:02:03
Yes, thank you, Madam Chair. 00:02:05
Good afternoon, board members. 00:02:08
And public. 00:02:11
Thanks for being here. 00:02:12
As Madam Chair stated, this is a request for variances. 00:02:15
For 1204 Middle St. 00:02:19
Here is the location of the property. 00:02:22
Along the corner of Osceola Middle and Station 12. 00:02:26
This is the existing parish hall. 00:02:30
The background and the. 00:02:33
Parish offices building up front. 00:02:35
And the church is located on the other side of Station 12. 00:02:38
Orientation. 00:02:41
Here's the posting on the property advertising this evening's meeting. 00:02:44
And here are a few. 00:02:48
Photographs of the property. 00:02:50
This is back at the. 00:02:52
Back corner next to the adjacent residential property. 00:02:54
This is the front facade of the parish hall. 00:02:59
The side facade along Station 12. 00:03:02
Another shot of the front facade from the rear of the. 00:03:06
Irish offices and then. 00:03:09
Looking across the asphalt parking lot behind the church. 00:03:11
There's the church and the. 00:03:15
Parasol Here's an aerial shot of the Parish Hollow. 00:03:18
Right here in the middle of the screen. 00:03:23
And then this is from the. 00:03:26
County's parcel map. 00:03:29
And you can see where this. 00:03:30
Building sits on this lot pretty. 00:03:32
Tightly up against the side to side property line and near the rear property line. 00:03:36
This is the existing site plan. 00:03:45
Property that. 00:03:48
Talking about Tonight is highlighted in yellow. 00:03:50
That's the existing building. 00:03:54
And then this is the proposed building right here. 00:03:56
When we look at side by side from. 00:04:04
Last month. This is what was proposed in March. Here's the proposal. 00:04:07
Through June. 00:04:12
This is slightly smaller building. 00:04:14
Speaking of that size change, it's. 00:04:23
Little over 1000 feet less than the proposal from last month. 00:04:26
Which makes it just under. 00:04:32
Just over 4750 square feet larger than the. 00:04:36
Existing parish hall. 00:04:40
And. 00:04:43
Make this bigger for y'all. 00:04:44
Some notable pieces of this. 00:04:48
Are that? 00:04:51
You know, there there's a number of places where the building would be a little bit bigger. 00:04:53
The kitchen would grow by about 150 square feet. 00:04:59
Bathroom space would increase by about 500 square feet. 00:05:03
The existing library and conference room. 00:05:08
This is the. 00:05:12
Sorry, I should probably should have mentioned that this is the existing floor plan of the first floor right here. This is the 00:05:13
proposed floor plan of the first floor down here. 00:05:18
Currently this is the library and conference room. 00:05:24
Which is about 360 square feet. 00:05:27
And the proposed conference room. 00:05:30
Would be this yellow building yellow space here? 00:05:33
And then this would be the library. 00:05:37
Next to it and. 00:05:39
Total of 830 square feet. 00:05:41
So much more. 00:05:45
Conference room space, The actual. 00:05:47
Call it the. 00:05:52
What would you the congregation room? Yeah, the. 00:05:57
Where the? 00:06:01
Telecasting of the masses occurs is. 00:06:03
Going to increase by about 100. 00:06:06
50 square feet. It's not a big increase. 00:06:09
From what exists today to what is proposed down here. 00:06:12
The driving force for the increase in square footage. 00:06:16
It turns out is. 00:06:20
Circulation. 00:06:22
So if you look at the existing building, it has one. 00:06:25
23 points of access to it and it has these narrow hallways. 00:06:29
And classrooms that come off of. 00:06:34
The main built main room. 00:06:37
With no egress to the outdoors. 00:06:39
The proposed building would have 1/2. 00:06:42
3/4. 00:06:46
5. 00:06:48
I want to say there. 00:06:51
7 But I'm only counting five points of the egress. 00:06:52
But the. 00:06:57
Square footage of this space. The width of these corridors is. 00:06:59
Increases the. 00:07:03
Circulation space in the building from about 800 square feet to. 00:07:06
Almost 3700 square feet. 00:07:10
That's the bulk of the increase in square footages for safety reasons and accessibility. 00:07:13
Then similarly, this is the second floor floor plan. 00:07:22
Also has better circulation. There's also an elevator. 00:07:28
Proposed to access this space, which is currently unavailable. 00:07:31
Umm, kind of. 00:07:39
Speaking to safety, the existing parish hall lacks a sprinkler system, which would be required in the new building. 00:07:40
And then? 00:07:50
Moving on. 00:07:52
They're they're requesting variances from several sections of the ordinance. 00:07:53
This is in the religious institution requirements that there be 1 building on the lot and that meet the set back and lot 00:07:59
coverages. 00:08:03
These are existing nonconformities that. 00:08:07
Are present today. 00:08:11
And would be present in the new building, so. 00:08:13
Requesting A variance to make that a conforming situation there. 00:08:16
And then for the side yard. 00:08:20
Setbacks. These are also. 00:08:23
From the ground level, these are existing nonconformities. The current building sits. 00:08:27
About 8 feet off of that side property line. 00:08:32
The new building would be pulled back further to be at least 10 feet, which is a minimum allowed in our ordinance so. 00:08:36
While it still requires A variance from the 15 foot. 00:08:43
It would be. 00:08:47
Within the realm of what is allowed currently, the building is in a place where it wouldn't be allowed to be located. 00:08:48
At 7 1/2 to 8 feet from the property line. 00:08:56
Then the ground floor articulations. 00:08:59
The current building has no articulations on the side. 00:09:04
This building would have an articulation that would still. 00:09:07
Not meet our 38 foot length. 00:09:11
What is being proposed is not a single family home. 00:09:14
So this. 00:09:18
Certainly makes some sense that this wouldn't be a. 00:09:19
Facet of the design for a. 00:09:24
Congregation hall versus these ordinances that are written for single family development. 00:09:27
And the second floor elements. 00:09:33
Current building has a second floor that's all within the roof lines of the of the building. 00:09:36
This proposed building would have a second floor that is. 00:09:42
Set along that side property line nearest to the Fort. 00:09:46
Moultrie Visitor Center. 00:09:50
And it would exceed the 32 feet without articulation, so that's the reason for the variance there. 00:09:52
And then? 00:10:00
The requirement that there only be a 32 linear feet of. 00:10:02
Facade within the 15 foot set back. 00:10:07
Would not be met by. This building is not currently met either, so this would be. 00:10:11
Further, umm. 00:10:15
Removal of the existing nonconformity to make it a. 00:10:18
Conformity by variance. 00:10:22
And then the again with the second floor element subject to a second. 00:10:25
A secondary set back. 00:10:29
Current current situation does not have a second floor that needs to be set back, it's set inside the roof. 00:10:31
That's they're proposing A2 story. 00:10:38
Side to side along the side of the Fort. 00:10:41
So that's the reason for this variance request. 00:10:45
Moving on to the principal building coverage area. 00:10:48
The current coverage on the lot is. 00:10:52
In excess of what is allowed. 00:10:58
And the new? 00:11:00
Proposal would increase that slightly. 00:11:02
On the impervious coverage. 00:11:09
Current coverage on the lots that. 00:11:11
Say 51%. 00:11:14
And the impervious coverage being proposed would reduce that to 46%. 00:11:16
Which is above the 30% that is allowed by ordinance. 00:11:21
And then for principal building square footage. 00:11:26
Maximum building is allowed to be 5600 square feet. The current building on the lot is. 00:11:30
About 12,700 square feet and the. 00:11:36
New building that's being proposed. 00:11:39
It was around 18,500 last month and they've reduced it to about 17,500 this month so. 00:11:42
Still 4700 feet larger, but as I discussed earlier. 00:11:51
Great portion, almost 40% of that is for circulation and improves. 00:11:56
Public safety. 00:12:01
So there's the principal building square footage. 00:12:04
When when the board. 00:12:08
Reviewing variants there for hardship tests that. 00:12:10
Need to be found to be in place for the granting of a variance. 00:12:14
One being. 00:12:20
Extraordinary exceptional conditions pertaining to the particular piece of property. 00:12:22
The fact that this is a religious institution and it's been. 00:12:27
Used as such for. 00:12:32
Sometimes is an extraordinary exceptional condition in the area. 00:12:34
It's unique to this property. 00:12:40
These conditions do not generally apply to other properties in the vicinity. That's the only church par. 00:12:44
Parcels in the area. 00:12:50
These conditions, the application of the ordinance to the particular property, would effectively prohibit or unreasonably restrict 00:12:55
the utilization. 00:12:58
Without the variances, the existing parish hall would continue to deteriorate because it. 00:13:03
Couldn't be replaced. 00:13:09
And there would be. 00:13:11
It would maintain its lack of modern accessibility and safety. 00:13:13
And would continue to be a non conforming structure in the Rs district. 00:13:17
The authorization of a variance will not be of substantial detriment to adjacent property or the public good, and the character of 00:13:23
the district will not be harmed by the granting of the variance. 00:13:28
The proposal would enhance the visual appeal of the property. 00:13:35
Would improve on nonconformities that detract from neighborhood compatibility. 00:13:39
And would improve the handling of storm water on the property to the benefit of all neighboring properties. 00:13:43
As such, staff is recommending approval of the variances requested to enable the redevelopment of the Parish hall. 00:13:49
The improvements in the non conforming setbacks. 00:13:58
And impervious coverage will enhance neighborhood compatibility. 00:14:01
And increased massing. 00:14:05
And coverage are countered by the massing's location closer to the adjacent commercial governmental use bill at the Fort Moultrie 00:14:08
Visitor Center. 00:14:12
And the enhanced circulation patterns in the building. 00:14:17
Promoting accessibility and public safety. 00:14:20
An increase in. 00:14:23
Principal building coverage and square footage are both offset by the important reduction in impervious coverage which will allow. 00:14:26
The larger building to better address stormwater concerns in the area. 00:14:33
Than the existing smaller building. 00:14:37
With its asphalt parking lot currently due. 00:14:39
The Board should consider these recommendations in accordance with the standards of Section 21179 of the zoning ordinance. 00:14:42
Thank you, Charles. 00:14:49
You have any questions of Charles? 00:14:51
OK. Eddie, would you like to present for the applicant? 00:14:59
Oh, oh, sorry. 00:15:12
There we go. 00:15:13
Good evening. My name is Eddie Faber with E Faber Architects. I am representing Monsignor McInerney. 00:15:19
His congregation and Catholic Diocese of Charleston I have with me. 00:15:24
Joel Trantham from my office. Michael Strobel. 00:15:27
And Jared Raskin Allah, who've been working on this project. 00:15:30
Diligently and appreciate it. 00:15:33
For the benefit of the of the Board members and the public that were not here at the prior presentation, we've got just a quick 00:15:36
summary. 00:15:40
And then? 00:15:43
Someone my team will present some more detailed facts and will present the current proposal. 00:15:45
So just just by way of introduction to those who weren't here last time. 00:15:49
The property owned by the diocese. 00:15:53
Circled in the red presently. 00:15:56
And at the last meeting, it was granted a special exception to be designated a religious institution, which is not uncommon for 00:15:59
many properties on the island. 00:16:03
The portion that we're Speaking of this evening is where the. 00:16:07
Proposed new hall would go and the Gray shaded area where the current existing hall. 00:16:10
Sits presently. 00:16:15
As Charles referenced, it backs up to. 00:16:17
The National Park. 00:16:20
And the whole intent of replacing the building that sits there. 00:16:22
Felt like obviously that that was the most neighborhood compatible solution to this. 00:16:26
And definitely improvement. 00:16:30
To the area, the building and. 00:16:33
Least effect with backing up to the. 00:16:36
The park building. 00:16:39
Just orientation photos that everybody's familiar with the area, obviously. 00:16:41
The Park Service buildings where the Old Navy Army hospital used to be. 00:16:45
The bottom left photo you can see the roof of the hall as it sits presently backing up to the asphalt parking lot of the Park 00:16:49
Service. 00:16:53
Another one illustrating that property as well. 00:17:00
These are general photos of the existing condition of the building. 00:17:04
The asphalt paving that is there, all of which will go away to pervious parking as we have spoken about previously. 00:17:08
Umm, current condition. 00:17:15
There are significant planted buffers, particularly along the backside of the park area. 00:17:19
On the buildings buffered by the historic building. 00:17:24
On the front of it and Middle St. as well. 00:17:27
Their buffer elements between the residential structure to the rear of the current hall. 00:17:29
Which would be remain, which would remain an enhanced as with those on the. 00:17:33
Rear section of the area where the parking area would be. 00:17:37
Just just quickly, this area has always been. 00:17:41
Had a historic designation, although it not our historic use, although not formally designated as such. 00:17:44
The general area had been located as and known as Birmingham Square since 1871. 00:17:49
Area photos of that time demonstrate the church. 00:17:59
Sitting where it sits presently. 00:18:03
Open space around it, which is something we sought to maintain from the get go. 00:18:06
And on the Sanborn maps to the left. 00:18:10
You can see where the church is and the fact of. 00:18:13
Of how many of those properties have changed, and our goal with the church property is that it remains as open as possible without 00:18:16
another structure. 00:18:20
On that section of the property. 00:18:24
Photograph historically. 00:18:28
Army Hospital used to be. 00:18:30
There right where the current visitor center is presently. 00:18:32
And it's not an uncommon thing. Again, I have, no pun intended, preaching to the choir that there's several religious institutions 00:18:37
here. 00:18:40
On the island. 00:18:44
Some of them have a formal designation, some don't. 00:18:45
I think all know. 00:18:48
So much on the island is just zoned. 00:18:50
Residential everything. 00:18:52
Short of some elements in the commercial district. 00:18:54
So it's no wonder that. 00:18:56
Many of these things do not apply. Much of the things that we're asking for is Charles reference are already existing non 00:18:58
conforming. 00:19:02
Uses of the existing structure and conditions that exist there presently. 00:19:05
We have similar things. 00:19:09
Sullivan's Island Baptist Church. 00:19:11
Church at the Holy Cross, which is just across the street from me. 00:19:13
Where I live and Sunrise Presbyterian Upright Beach Inlet. 00:19:16
We'll quickly run through the drawings as presented last time. Again, just a refresher for those that were not here. 00:19:22
The existing site plan as things sit presently. 00:19:27
With the parish hall in the dark Gray on the far right of the lot. 00:19:30
The current paved areas you can see. 00:19:34
They are behind the church and in between the church and the house that fronts Middle St. 00:19:37
Proposed. 00:19:43
Building as we had at that time. 00:19:45
And with the parking area to the rear, which again, although not a part of this application this evening, is something that would 00:19:47
be. 00:19:51
Sustainable has to accommodate all of the drainage, improve the conditions there. 00:19:54
All pervious pavers buffers, so something that was. 00:19:58
Very thoughtfully located in a way that doesn't impact. 00:20:02
That area negatively, it improves it. 00:20:05
And maintaining a green band. 00:20:08
Of residential. 00:20:11
Yard, for lack of a better word, all along Osceola and Middle St. rather than parking backed up to the church. 00:20:13
As it is presently. 00:20:18
At that time we showed. 00:20:20
Some rough renderings of your approach as you come down the island and down Middle St. and turn on Osceola. 00:20:22
With the proposed structure. 00:20:28
Behind it at the new hall. 00:20:30
Again. 00:20:32
With the deliberate intent of this being a background building, the church and the historic structures forward of it are the ones 00:20:33
that. 00:20:36
Set the tone and the ones that. 00:20:39
Have the attention here. 00:20:41
At that time also. 00:20:45
Illustrated. 00:20:46
Current Hall and. 00:20:48
How those compare to? 00:20:50
What the proposed hall would be the Gray and blue elements. 00:20:53
Overlaid on the building or the things that are presently on the site versus what would be there with a proposed new plan? 00:20:56
One thing again that was a bit unfortunate, was there some? 00:21:05
Letters that went out and and respectfully. I think it was just either misunderstanding and misinformation. 00:21:11
So we just felt it was important to address a lot of that and we've done so in this presentation and with neighbors that we've met 00:21:16
in neighborhood meetings that we've had. 00:21:20
And one of them was saying that it would have adverse consequences for the proposed construction would for the neighborhood. 00:21:25
But the proposed building, as we said, is. 00:21:32
Isolated to the one that abuts the commercial and institution for Moultrie Lock. 00:21:34
And as Father McInerney has referenced, he said. 00:21:39
Several of the neighbors immediately around there, all of whom we've spoken to when you showed you in a graphic. 00:21:42
Are in full support of the proposal as it stands. 00:21:46
That is demonstrated by this, and this is where we started at the last meeting. 00:21:50
So all of the properties. 00:21:55
That have checkmarks on them. 00:21:58
Are adjacent to what is now the religious designated property. 00:22:00
Of the church. 00:22:04
The Blue Square rectangle there is where the new hall would be. 00:22:06
But at the last meeting too, we were then asked to. 00:22:10
Expand that. 00:22:15
Outrage to people beyond who may not have been spoken to. 00:22:17
We offered up a meeting and some other things. I'll let Michael speak to that. 00:22:21
Yeah, so Michael Stroppel with the EFAV architects as well. 00:22:28
So coming out of the meeting on May 8th last month, there were kind of four takeaways that we had. The first one was obviously to 00:22:31
come back in 30 days, which here we are. 00:22:35
The second one was to create a comparison of the existing building, and we ended up doing a deep dive analysis of that existing 00:22:40
building, which we'll show in just a minute. 00:22:44
The third one was to meet with further neighbors kind of beyond the immediate vicinity of our site, which we did. We had a 00:22:49
neighborhood meeting as well that we'll get into in this presentation. 00:22:53
And asked if there was any ability to reduce the square footage of the building even slightly, which we did reduce the square 00:22:59
footage by over 1000 square feet. 00:23:02
So jumping in to the analysis of the existing building, again, this is not something we would typically do for a building that's 00:23:07
planning on being demolished. 00:23:11
But we've had a lot of questions from neighbors and from the board last time about how does this new building compare to the 00:23:16
existing building? 00:23:19
So we wanted to make sure that we could answer all those questions completely accurately. 00:23:23
And so again, one question that's come up multiple times in the neighbor meeting and at the at the previous board. 00:23:28
Was, you know, why can't we just use the existing footprint? Why can't we use essentially the same size building all of those 00:23:35
things? 00:23:38
And so when we jumped into comparing that existing building. 00:23:42
Again, just looking at the variances that would be required today to build that existing building. 00:23:45
All five of the variances that we're requesting today would still be required to build that existing building. 00:23:50
Many of which we've improved upon. I think all of them except for the square footage number. 00:23:56
And we would be required to request 1/6 variance to build that existing building. 00:24:01
Which would be a request for a variance for. 00:24:05
Set back. 00:24:09
Which would affect? 00:24:10
Negatively affect the only residential neighbor that's up against this property, so we're pulling our new proposed hall further 00:24:11
away. 00:24:15
And respecting our only residential neighbor more than what the what the existing proposal does. 00:24:18
And then the other thing that got brought up and there was a question at the last meeting that. 00:24:25
What is the occupancy of the new building? 00:24:31
And we gave an answer that referenced the code required occupancy, but I think there was a little bit of misunderstanding. 00:24:33
There is a code requirement. 00:24:40
In the International Building Code that gets into. 00:24:42
A calculation that essentially levels the playing field of all different commercial buildings with different uses. 00:24:45
You've got assembly uses like what we have, you've got office uses, you've got residential uses, mercantile uses. 00:24:52
All of those things. 00:24:57
And it is a calculation. 00:24:59
That gives us a number that helps us to size our safety equipment and our egress. 00:25:01
And so that number. 00:25:06
Tells us. 00:25:08
That is again a calculation that comes from the code. What it doesn't say is this is how many people we plan on having in this 00:25:09
building. 00:25:13
Which I think there was a misunderstanding there. 00:25:17
And So what we did was. 00:25:19
We did an analysis, a code analysis on the existing hall. 00:25:21
Versus the new home? 00:25:25
So again, we threw out a number of 600 at the last meeting, which was pretty close to. 00:25:26
Where we landed. 00:25:31
But when we look at the existing building, the existing hall. 00:25:32
From a code requirement standpoint, would hold 580 people. 00:25:35
We've also in the works of demolishing the Shamrock House next door, which is an education facility that's being incorporated into 00:25:39
this building. 00:25:42
So if you take those 38 occupants. 00:25:46
The campus overall is going from 618 occupants to 627. That's an increase of nine. 00:25:48
So I think what the question was really asking was. 00:25:56
What is the size of this congregating room in comparison to what it was before? And is this going to be a significantly larger 00:25:59
congregating room that's going to allow the congregation to grow? 00:26:05
The answer is no. 00:26:10
And I think Charles mentioned that in his. 00:26:12
His presentation as well. 00:26:14
So we did an overlay again of the existing size of the congregating room, which is the red dashed line. 00:26:16
Versus the proposed size of the congregating room, which is the yellow. 00:26:22
Shaded rectangle and we've got a scale figure in there just to show. 00:26:26
It increases by three to four feet on each side. It's about the width of one person on each side. 00:26:30
So the actual number of people that will come into this building. 00:26:36
Are not significantly different than what is there today. 00:26:40
So I guess the next question is, if that is the case, why is our building 4700 square feet bigger? 00:26:44
And there's a lot of code implications and requirements. 00:26:51
And I'm going to let Joel kind of jump into the details of that, but there I think Charles hit on it a little bit. 00:26:54
As well. 00:26:59
My name is Joel Trantham. I'm also an architect with the Eva architects here. And I would like to thank Charles for giving the 00:27:03
extensive breakdown that you did. 00:27:07
And running through all those numbers, we. 00:27:11
Looking at laying those out and how to explain that best and and. 00:27:13
Instead of rattling off a bunch of numbers, we. 00:27:17
Put together this graphic. 00:27:21
Looking on the left side is the existing plan. It's the first floor on the top and it's the second floor on the bottom. 00:27:23
Compared to our proposed plan at the same scale. 00:27:29
1st floor on the top, second floor on the bottom. 00:27:32
The space that's highlighted in Gray. 00:27:34
Is our circulation, Circulation and support space. 00:27:37
This is 84% of the requested increase, which is a significant portion. 00:27:40
We in between the last meeting this we're able to tighten up that space sum. 00:27:47
But the reason why we can't fully. 00:27:51
Get rid of that space is because what that includes. 00:27:54
Are the handicap accessibility requirements, there are certain sizing, spacing, turnabouts that we have to do? 00:27:58
There's life safety requirements, There's pump rooms, riser rooms, enunciator control panels. 00:28:05
There's code compliance stairs and elevators. Those are not in the existing structure. 00:28:11
There's code required, bathrooms that require turnabout radiuses on either side in order to also meet egress, and fixtures that 00:28:16
are calculated that don't certainly meet code. 00:28:20
Right now. 00:28:24
New buildings have it and utility rooms in which we have to incorporate things and there's also code required walkways. You're not 00:28:25
allowed under the building code to walk through 1 space into another space that's there because people have died in buildings and. 00:28:33
These code and life safety items are always instituted into the code. 00:28:40
So that we can produce the safest buildings we can. 00:28:44
Another item that was brought up at the meeting is that this was going to be the largest building on Sullivan's Island. It was 00:28:50
difficult. 00:28:53
At that time to directly address that. 00:28:57
But we've gone and done an exhaustive analysis of all the buildings on Sullivan's Island so that we can present that adequately to 00:29:00
you. 00:29:03
This is a diagram showing the building that we're in right now. That's the building labeled 2 on this diagram. 00:29:08
We went to the website for Creech and Associates and interestingly enough it calls it out as 18,000 square feet. 00:29:14
Our building is 17,500. It's also fully elevated, one story and our building is not. 00:29:20
There's a pink building across the street which is 2056 Myrtle. 00:29:26
It has an 18,000 square foot envelope which most people probably passed as they walked into here. 00:29:30
Since it's turned perpendicular to the street and lengthwise is buffered on either side, it doesn't present a large facade. 00:29:35
That's an organizational element we're instituting in our building. 00:29:42
There's also. 00:29:46
Building out the back, which doesn't have any articulations, but it's a 24,000 square foot building, that's not what we're 00:29:47
proposing. 00:29:50
As you can see on this diagram, we put our footprint for comparison there. 00:29:55
So there was a comparison made to the Sullivans Island Elementary School. 00:29:59
As you can see, this is the footprint of our building that we're proposing. 00:30:03
11,732 square feet. 00:30:07
This is the footprint of the Sullivans Island Elementary School. 00:30:12
It's six times larger footprint and a five times larger square footage. We just felt like it was. 00:30:15
Important to be accurate when we're comparing these structures. 00:30:20
When we look at parish campuses. 00:30:25
This is the size of our footprint. 00:30:27
This is the size of Holy Cross as parish campus. 00:30:31
I believe this campus clearly shows that with a thoughtful design strategy. 00:30:34
A larger Paris campus can Nestle neatly and contribute to neighborhood compatibility. 00:30:39
Which is one of the goals we are striving to achieve in this process. 00:30:44
We also met with neighbors. 00:30:48
And I'll let Eddie speak to that. 00:30:49
Thank you. 00:30:53
At the last meeting they just request to reach out wider and and. 00:30:55
Monsignor McInerney took it upon himself to send an e-mail out. 00:31:00
That was forwarded to others and others and others and everybody invited to the existing parish hall. 00:31:04
Just. 00:31:08
Hear this presentation and ask any questions that they may have. 00:31:09
And many showed up. 00:31:13
Most of the questions had to. 00:31:15
Do with traffic and concern related to that? 00:31:17
And our response tonight is as it was then. 00:31:21
That the goal with what we're doing with that sustainable parking area that is pushed to the rear of the lot. 00:31:26
As supported by all of those that are immediately adjacent and affected by it. 00:31:30
Is to pull some of the cars off the street that line the street during the masses. 00:31:35
Now that happens. 00:31:39
You know, once a week or doing feast days Sunday mornings. 00:31:41
And, and they were asked would they be willing to make concessions regarding to. 00:31:45
If you exit off Osceola not turning right, could you turn left? 00:31:50
All of those things, Monsignor, the church, everybody is absolutely open to. 00:31:53
The parking area would be gated and although that's not a part of this meeting or this this approval and I just feel like it needs 00:31:57
to be addressed. 00:32:00
We are certainly open to it, but it felt like we needed to be. 00:32:05
Perfectly straight up that all of that gets reviewed by South Carolina dot. 00:32:07
So they make the final call on it. 00:32:11
But we are open to all of those things as that proceeds through the process. 00:32:13
Going into our currently proposed. 00:32:19
Plan. As we said in the previous, nothing has changed in fact, that the hall would be located where the current one is, adjacent 00:32:22
to the National Park Park. 00:32:26
Parking lot. 00:32:30
The existing. 00:32:32
Hall, the proposed Hall and as we reference and as requested by the board last time, was there any way to. 00:32:33
Squeeze some square footage out. 00:32:39
Of it we did, we took 1000 square feet. 00:32:41
Out of the building. 00:32:44
Which made the footprint smaller. 00:32:45
And renderings that we had at that time of that approach. 00:32:49
Which are the same caliber that we did the first time. 00:32:52
But when you compare the two, you'll see that the building behind the historic house on the right. 00:32:56
Is smaller. 00:33:01
And our footprint. 00:33:03
Similarly, got smaller. 00:33:05
Again, all of the things that were referenced prior. 00:33:08
With related to. 00:33:12
Code required elements are not things that we can cut back on, and that's where the bulk of all of this increase comes from. 00:33:14
But regardless, still felt like this building. 00:33:20
Nestle's extremely well where it always has. 00:33:22
The other thing that as we move through design review board on this are very conscious of the fact that again. 00:33:26
This is, as I said, as a background building. We are not trying to steal the Thunder from the church or any of the historic 00:33:32
structures there. 00:33:34
It serves a purpose and a function. That doesn't mean that. 00:33:37
Cannot be well articulated and. 00:33:40
Steadily pick up on elements of larger structures on the island. 00:33:43
I hadn't referenced previously. 00:33:48
At least tonight's meeting. But the scale comparison up there gives. 00:33:50
Some sense of how this building? 00:33:54
Compares to other large structures that are just residential on the island. 00:33:56
And. 00:34:01
The way we would articulate it, too, would be with porches and recesses and things of that nature. 00:34:03
That allow it to have even more breathing room off the street than it does presently. 00:34:08
Most importantly to our neighbor to the rear that we were pulling back. 00:34:12
From where the building sits presently to give more room for buffer. 00:34:16
At a height that is lower than what's? 00:34:19
Allowable. 00:34:22
And would would potentially allow of you to return for our neighbor to the rear. 00:34:23
That is again just the overlays of the existing structures and the. 00:34:29
Current one the views of as it stands presently. 00:34:34
And we did a series of. 00:34:38
Enhanced renderings here that show what? 00:34:40
We think is. 00:34:43
Most important, particularly with the neighborhood compatibility issue. 00:34:44
Our existing view and a rendering showing the proposed view. 00:34:48
With the building tucked back to the rear of the historic house. 00:34:52
Church is still front and center. 00:34:55
Similarly here. 00:34:57
Another thing which is important which again. 00:34:59
Will fall to dot, but it is our intent that that lawn area forward of the house to the rear, the historic house to the rear. 00:35:01
Will be returned to the full turn so people don't cut that corner. It's a safety issue presently. It's something we would be 00:35:08
addressing as we move forward. 00:35:12
The proposed. 00:35:17
And down. 00:35:20
Station 12. 00:35:22
The existing and the proposed. 00:35:23
And that's our conceptual massing as we move forward with this. Needless to say, all of that gets developed as we move through. 00:35:25
Design Review board. 00:35:30
Again, I think it's important and respectfully to all our neighbors that we've spoken to that support or not. 00:35:33
Those that are most impacted by this is where we started and expanded our circle. 00:35:40
And and all of them. 00:35:45
Have voiced nothing but support for this project. 00:35:47
So we demonstrated and don't need to go through this in detail. I know there are other items after ours here and there are people 00:35:51
that want to speak. 00:35:55
That we are in compliance with all of the conditions that are set for the variance test. 00:35:59
You'll have copies of that in your application. 00:36:04
And most importantly, I think it's been said best that the variances that we're requesting here they already. 00:36:06
Are conditions that exist. 00:36:13
We just need them to continue the use here. They're not detrimental. They're instrumental to allow the parish to construct the 00:36:15
background building. 00:36:19
Besides that, existing institutional Port Moultrie Visitor Center, preserving the historic views and open space. 00:36:23
Surrounding the landmark sanctuary. 00:36:28
An adjacent landmark structures. 00:36:30
So not too much of A stretch that our views wouldn't change. 00:36:32
Too much from the perspective of the historic photo of Malone. 00:36:37
So happy to answer any questions. 00:36:41
I do. I have. 00:36:47
A couple questions. 00:36:50
So, Mr. Favour, how do you? 00:36:51
What would be your response to someone that says that? 00:36:56
The new structure. 00:37:00
It's a nonconformity. 00:37:01
Now yes, and 21-149 says that. 00:37:04
The extent, degree, size, and frequency of any nonconformity shall not, shall not be increased in any manner. How do I How do we? 00:37:09
Vote to allow what you're asking us to do and still. 00:37:17
Be hold true be compliance with 21-149. 00:37:21
Yes, Sir, I just think it's still. 00:37:26
Falls within those other conditions where it's an extraordinary condition here. 00:37:29
It's unique to this property has been historically. 00:37:33
And for us to. 00:37:35
Maintain that use even in a building as it sits presently. 00:37:37
We have to meet the code requirements regarding egress. 00:37:40
Elevators, all of those things which. 00:37:44
To do that in the existing envelope. 00:37:45
Would basically render the existing building useless. 00:37:48
So. 00:37:51
Current code issue. 00:37:53
That it plays a big part, yes. And why? 00:37:54
There is some increase in. 00:37:57
The continued or expansion of the nonconformities? Yes, Sir. 00:38:00
And then? 00:38:05
The traffic issue. 00:38:06
Seems to me to be sort of a big thing for folks and and I get it that. 00:38:08
The congregation isn't going to expand, so you're not going to have any more people coming on Sundays. 00:38:12
Guess I'm sorry. 00:38:18
You're not going to have any more folks coming to church on Sunday. 00:38:21
Once this is built versus. 00:38:26
This Sunday, that is. 00:38:28
The absolute intent and I'm happy to let someone from the church. 00:38:30
Speak to that, but it's almost a premise of theirs that it's not the intent to increase the congregation the. 00:38:33
Other issue though is. 00:38:41
So. 00:38:43
And maybe someone from the church has to speak to this. 00:38:44
It seems to me. 00:38:47
That folks are concerned about the traffic being more often. You're not going to expand your congregation, however. 00:38:48
When you have this facility completed, you're going to have more people coming on the island. 00:38:56
To do whatever it is that is. 00:39:00
Been undertaken at the at the new Parish Hall. 00:39:03
I would beg to differ. 00:39:07
Respectfully. 00:39:10
Because I think the same functions that happen now will just be better accommodated. But it's not that they happen more 00:39:11
frequently. They're more different. They they have set times and days that all of these things happen. 00:39:16
So if you had 100 people coming on Wednesday night, there'll still be 100 people coming on Wednesday night. Yes, Sir. 00:39:21
Yes, Sir. 00:39:27
Agreed, and I only bring this up here because I think it will be helpful as people speak. 00:39:29
And again, I know it's not. 00:39:33
Part of tonight, but it's part of what everybody wants to discuss a little bit. So for the record. 00:39:35
The traffic issue. 00:39:39
And I'll let the church speak to it. 00:39:41
All I can say is it's not their intent and the building. 00:39:43
Won't accommodate more people. 00:39:46
It accommodates, as we saw by the comparison, from a code standpoint. 00:39:48
Minimally more than what? 00:39:53
The current one does. 00:39:55
Parking and and I drive down there every Sunday morning and. 00:39:57
Saturday evenings with my dog in the golf court. Yes, they park on the side of the street. They're still gonna park on the side of 00:40:00
the street. I mean, I hate to say that, but the goal was to get some of that parking off of the street as much as we could. 00:40:06
And I have a lot of respect for our neighbors at the end of the island. 00:40:13
And and friends and clients that live down that way, but but. 00:40:17
I just again respectfully find it difficult to believe that. 00:40:21
Even with the current low that people drive all the way down to the. 00:40:25
Boat landing and come back and turn around or come back at her. We have totally agreed and said that. 00:40:29
With the permission of dot. 00:40:35
More than. 00:40:37
To have the egress. 00:40:38
Off of Osceola either be only an ingress, only a left turn, but we just don't have the ability to promise that to anybody. 00:40:40
So. 00:40:47
Yes, Sir. Yeah. Just as an FYI, in our approval of the special exception, we did say that dot would rule on ingress and egress 00:40:49
from the parking area. So. 00:40:53
That's in the engineers and the DOT's hand. 00:40:58
Mr. Elliott, would you like somebody from the church to address? Kind of. 00:41:02
Functions or what happens? 00:41:05
Yeah. OK. Wait a minute. OK, Sorry. 00:41:07
Yeah, yeah. So I think what we're gonna do if we see if we have any more questions of Eddie. 00:41:11
Do not. 00:41:18
Michael. 00:41:19
OK. 00:41:20
All right, we may. We, you know, when we start deliberating, we're probably going to ask you questions again. 00:41:21
All right, we have 25 people. 00:41:27
Signed up to speak. 00:41:31
So, umm. 00:41:32
What I'm going to do is I'm going to ask someone to speak for the church, if that's Father McInerney. 00:41:34
Then I will ask somebody that wants to speak against the variance. 00:41:40
And then we're going to do some voting because I do not want to be here until midnight, OK? We're going to do it just like we did 00:41:44
last time, so from McInerney. 00:41:49
My neighbor who has to get up to another meeting? Yes, go ahead. 00:41:54
You yield your time. 00:41:58
No, you have to go to the podium. 00:42:00
And you have to state your, your name and your address please. 00:42:02
Chris Young, 402 Station 12th St. on Sullivan's We live directly behind the. 00:42:07
Proposed new parish lived there for. 00:42:12
10 or 1211 years, we've obviously gotten known father. 00:42:15
Over the years, both. 00:42:19
Us putting up with them and probably them more putting up with us with just two children so. 00:42:21
We've met with their land planners, the architects they've been. 00:42:26
Super courteous and everything we've addressed we're probably the most. 00:42:31
Directed affected neighbor. 00:42:35
With the size and. 00:42:37
Shape of the building? Of course we have. 00:42:39
Some views of the ocean and um. 00:42:42
We couldn't be any more excited about the project. 00:42:46
Especially assuming. 00:42:49
We can get some. 00:42:52
Work with the dot, the traffic circulation. 00:42:53
Would be humongous because it's a disaster. 00:42:56
It's a disaster now it'll be a disaster. 00:42:59
Whether there's an old building or new building. So any relief on that? More parking the better on site, less parking off site. 00:43:02
I think with everybody else, my first question was to Eddie was like, whoa. 00:43:10
Is there gonna be another 200 people coming here? 00:43:14
And I'm fairly well knowledge in this business of development. 00:43:17
And once I dug into the plans. 00:43:21
Realized that the physical capacity. 00:43:24
You know, unless they started adding more classes on other days, which they obviously aren't. 00:43:28
The physical capacity of the building is only, you know, 5 to 10%, so. 00:43:33
Nothing that I think you would really feel. 00:43:37
Especially if you get the circulation of the parking but. 00:43:39
I know people have concerns of massing and. 00:43:43
I mean, I think it looks incredible. So I think. 00:43:46
Current situation is a real bad eyesore. 00:43:49
So I'm super excited about the project, happy to be a. 00:43:53
Supporter and and I believe with my neighbors we've talked as well in our street and. 00:43:57
And everybody's pretty excited, so just wanted to express that as being the direct neighbor and, um. 00:44:01
And just thanks for I really appreciate their time. They put a lot of time. 00:44:06
A lot of interest addressing all of our little nitpicky concerns. So just want to say that thank you, Paula McInerney. 00:44:11
You're up. 00:44:17
You want to wait. 00:44:20
OK, till the end. OK Would anyone like to speak against the variance? OK. 00:44:22
Go ahead, your name and address please. 00:44:26
Yeah. 00:44:29
My name is Neil Garfinkel. I live at 1001 Middle St. 00:44:31
Born in Charleston and coming to Sullivans my entire life. 00:44:36
And was fortunate enough to be able to buy a place here in 2011. Lived here as my primary residence since. 00:44:38
For me, this is about balancing the desire for development. 00:44:45
Church in excess of the current zoning regulations. 00:44:47
And this particularly in light of the existing size of the non conforming parish hall with the zoning codes overall objected to 00:44:51
preserve scale. 00:44:55
Limit congestion Congestion in residential neighborhoods for the benefit. 00:44:58
Town residents. 00:45:02
And to me, if the church wants to demolish the current parish, I'll improve the site. 00:45:04
And build a new hole that matches the old one plus whatever code. 00:45:08
Requirements are to bring up the code. 00:45:12
I think everyone would be highly supportive. 00:45:14
Even though the existing structure is already twice as large as you could, more than twice as large as you can build if you 00:45:17
started from scratch today without a variance. 00:45:20
But what they proposed is, you know, obviously something that's a bit more than that. 00:45:26
It's 40% larger, some of that. 00:45:30
Is code and Mr. Father. 00:45:33
And some of that is? 00:45:35
As you say circulation, which isn't technically code, but it's it it helps with. 00:45:36
Pulling the building. So if you took the 12,700 added code, I don't know what that would be, but it'd be something less. 00:45:40
Than the than what you proposed. 00:45:46
And it to me. 00:45:49
I understand that there's. 00:45:51
I in fact had a very simple conversation with the father about this, that there is no intent. 00:45:53
To have more people come or have the congregation get larger. But it is somewhat common sensical that if the building is larger. 00:45:59
If there are more classrooms and there are better classrooms. 00:46:05
That that may overtime result in more activities. 00:46:08
At the church and again, perhaps even a slight increase in attendance. 00:46:12
And that leads to traffic and congestion. 00:46:17
For every resident West of the church. And I understand Mr. Young is a neighbor. I don't really I understand why he doesn't have 00:46:19
objections. 00:46:23
But every single person that lives. 00:46:26
Past the church has to pass that intersection. 00:46:28
In order to get to their house, there is no bypass. It's not like the other churches. 00:46:31
On the arm where you can take Jasper, you can take middle. 00:46:34
There's only one way past and it's on Osceola or it's on Middle and the intersection of Station 12 and. 00:46:37
It just is a fact that you know the that is a choke point, particularly with beach traffic and boat traffic and the addition of 00:46:42
church traffic is a contributor. 00:46:46
To congestion getting past that point. 00:46:50
And I and you know, I just can't understand why the the board would allow a larger structure other than for code to be built. 00:46:53
Because the impact on all the residents West of the. 00:47:01
Church. 00:47:04
Is neutral to negative. 00:47:05
With traffic. 00:47:07
The zoning code, as you pointed out, Mr. Lee, clearly has a bias against the expansion of existing nonconformities. 00:47:09
And the threshold of ovarians is that you have to show that the existing code. 00:47:15
Results in a unreasonable. 00:47:21
Restriction of the utilization of the property and. 00:47:23
In my opinion, it's hard to meet that in that case. 00:47:26
Given the size of the existing parish hall with code additions. 00:47:29
And the successful operation if not perfect operation. 00:47:33
Of the Church for decades in its current footprint. 00:47:36
In my opinion, limiting the new parish hall to the existing square footage plus any code requirements that would need to be added. 00:47:40
Is a fair outcome because it would balance the desire of the church and its congregation to improve and modernize its aging 00:47:46
building, again primarily for the benefit of mostly non residents. 00:47:51
With the desires of residents to preserve the character peace and quiet. 00:47:57
Traffic included. 00:48:00
Of the western end of Sullivan's Island. 00:48:02
And to the extent that the board has a different view and approves. 00:48:04
The building as proposed. 00:48:08
I would. 00:48:11
Urged them to put on at least have a couple conditions around the use of the property. One is it. 00:48:12
That the church does. 00:48:16
And Father McInerney did discuss this at the. 00:48:18
Church employee traffic control people on busy Sundays or busy holidays to help with whatever that flow is, because it will be 00:48:21
different. 00:48:24
And secondly, I do have a concern that although. 00:48:29
Today, there is no weekday school at the church at the parish hall. 00:48:32
And I know that there's the school of Christ our King in Mount Pleasant. 00:48:37
And Father McInerney has told me that there's no plans to make this a school. And I take him in his word. But people and plans 00:48:40
change. 00:48:43
And. 00:48:47
If the Christ our King gets overcrowded. 00:48:48
And there's a building that's much larger, 40% larger under the current. 00:48:50
Proposal that that's something. 00:48:55
That the Church might consider. 00:48:57
Finally, I was hoping. I don't know whether there are parishioners. 00:49:00
On the on the board, but I would hope that if there are, they would recuse themselves. 00:49:04
From obviously from from this vote. 00:49:10
Can you state your first contingency again because I didn't follow what you traffic traffic control personnel like the traffic 00:49:12
control other churches and institutions and on busy days. 00:49:17
They have people out there to help. Coming out of a parking lot, have them turn left, turn right. 00:49:22
It's a free for all. 00:49:26
Currently and if that parking lot is bigger and there are more people. 00:49:27
It would be very helpful for, I think, everyone who lives down there to have the church help with an orderly. 00:49:32
Departure. 00:49:38
Of folks getting back to their. 00:49:39
Activities on the weekend? OK, on one of your points they would not be allowed to have a school. 00:49:41
At the church because schools. 00:49:49
On K5 through 12 are not allowed. 00:49:52
In our zoning ordinance, you can only have a Sunday school preschool, or you can have a preschool or a K5. 00:49:57
Is the only school certified that's allowed on this island is Sullivans Island Elementary? So they cannot expand and have a 00:50:05
school. 00:50:08
So no K through no K through 12. School is 3 for example. 00:50:12
No. 00:50:17
OK, only only certified preschools which is. 00:50:19
One to K5. 00:50:24
Which is. 00:50:26
I am a member of Church of the Holy Cross. I work in that 38,000 square foot building on Middle St. 00:50:27
We have a preschool. 00:50:33
Stops at K5. You cannot have a a certified school on Sullivans Island. It's in other in another area. 00:50:35
Excuse me, of the zoning ordinance. 00:50:42
Disabuse yourselves of that notion entirely. They cannot have a school. 00:50:43
OK. Thank you very much and thanks for your time. 00:50:47
You're welcome. 00:50:50
Now what I would like to do. 00:50:52
Is I'm going to ask. 00:50:55
That you limit those of you who want to speak. Unless you have a specific issue that you want to address, I'm going to ask you to 00:50:58
keep it under 30 seconds. 00:51:03
And um. 00:51:09
So how many of you want to speak with those conditions? 00:51:10
30 seconds. Do you see how many people are in the room? We have three other items on our agenda tonight. 00:51:17
So. 00:51:23
I don't want to hear the same thing over and over and over because what we're going to do is we're going to take a vote at the end 00:51:24
and say who agrees with what, right? And we will get a sense of that. Of course, we actually make our decisions based on the 00:51:28
zoning ordinance, so. 00:51:33
Not public opinion. 00:51:38
All right. 00:51:39
The gentleman in the back you. 00:51:42
We're going to go back and forth on for and against if we can. 00:51:44
Name. Address. 00:51:49
Make it clear I'm 4. I'm Larry Kabrowski. I live at 402 Sea Breeze Lane. 00:51:52
I lived there for. 00:51:58
Since 1981 I think. 00:51:59
I'm not a member of Stella Marist, but I think it's the best thing. It defines our. 00:52:01
Part of the island is the most beautiful. 00:52:05
Building on our island and everybody in this room. 00:52:07
And everybody who's against it. 00:52:11
They moved here and the church was here first. 00:52:13
And I've seen the parking and I've heard the arguments. 00:52:16
And it strikes me. 00:52:19
Almost in disbelief 99. 00:52:21
Percent of waking hours, there's no traffic there. 00:52:24
Is this maybe Wednesday night and Sunday morning? 00:52:27
The people that come to church, I can't think of better people to have there. We love having them there. 00:52:33
The traffic, the building. 00:52:39
Is big now, it'll be big later. It'll have very little, if any effect on us as neighbors. 00:52:42
But it would have a tremendous impact. 00:52:47
On the people that go to the church there in the facility. So if you weigh the things. 00:52:50
Most of our life there's like diligent and quiet. 00:52:54
And there's no traffic almost any of the time. 00:52:57
In this for a couple hours in a Sunday. 00:53:00
And maybe once a week I just find that. 00:53:03
This belief that people would find that interfere with the quality of our life there, I think. 00:53:07
That if this enhances us. 00:53:12
To have the church there, and I urge you. 00:53:14
To please pass this. 00:53:16
Thank you. OK. Thank you. Mr. Kowalski. Mr. Condon, you had your hand up. 00:53:18
When people finish, just wave your hands in the air so I can call on you. 00:53:25
Thanks for opportunity. My name is Charlie Condon and I live down. 00:53:29
Right now from the Church, 835. 00:53:33
And Emily and I have. We've been there for. 00:53:35
Since you go. 00:53:37
4 kids. 00:53:39
We've all attended currently attend Stella Maris and I want to speak to the traffic. 00:53:40
I want to echo what Larry's got to say, Yeah. 00:53:45
Yeah, I'm down there at 835 middle. 00:53:47
Walk to church, typically on Sunday morning. There's cars there, but. 00:53:50
The amount of traffic there. 00:53:55
Compared to what I see. 00:53:57
Here at the restaurant Alley is really minimal. 00:53:59
And I want to speak also to destination weddings quickly. I've had two daughters go through Stella Maris, I can assure you. 00:54:03
They were married at Stellenhaus. I can assure you that it will not become. 00:54:10
A destination wedding venue. 00:54:14
Father Mac. 00:54:17
No, you've got to go through. 00:54:18
Standards. 00:54:21
No cohabitation. 00:54:23
Raise your kid Catholic. 00:54:25
Attend the church regularly. The list goes on. 00:54:26
He focuses in on the sanctity of marriage. 00:54:30
And we're so glad he does. 00:54:33
And so I do want to let the board know that the chance of it being. 00:54:34
The destination wedding venue for the rich and famous. 00:54:39
Is nil. Thank you for the time. 00:54:42
OK. 00:54:45
Go ahead, Mr. Bastus, go ahead. 00:54:48
Madam Chair, Lady members of the Board. 00:55:00
My name is Joe Bustos. I live 649 King St. Mount Pleasant. 00:55:03
And. 00:55:07
I am the state current state representative for Mount Pleasant Sullivan's. I allow palms out to on dog. 00:55:08
And I just want to. 00:55:14
Right up front. 00:55:16
To save time, say I support this endeavor fully. 00:55:17
It's an obligation I feel that we all have. 00:55:21
To make room for the folks that are coming to South Carolina. 00:55:26
And I can tell you from the state. 00:55:30
View We've grown from 3.5 to over 5 million people. 00:55:32
And it's an obligation that we all have to try to accommodate. 00:55:37
Folks have come in here. We're not closing. 00:55:42
The borders, we're not going to shut the bridges. 00:55:44
They're coming. They're here. 00:55:47
And they're going to come to the beach. 00:55:49
On the weekends or any sun or any summer day that they can. 00:55:52
So. 00:55:56
This is this is 1 and we're wrestling with traffic. 00:55:58
In Colombia. 00:56:01
And we know it's bad because we've grown so much. 00:56:03
And I can assure you that we're going to continue to work on that problem. 00:56:07
And if. 00:56:11
Monsignor McInerney has a. 00:56:13
A problem he wants to bring to my attention to bring to the statehouse and reference to traffic. 00:56:15
I'm at his service so I will do that. 00:56:20
With that and I just like to say my view of this. 00:56:25
Is that I spent 3 terms on Mount Pleasant Town Council. 00:56:30
I'm on my third term in the State House. 00:56:35
I've seen the issues you're dealing with. 00:56:38
And I don't envy you. 00:56:40
But we must. 00:56:42
Accommodate the people. 00:56:44
Who are not going to come? They're here. 00:56:46
They're here. 00:56:48
And what a wonderful problem to have that people want to go to church. 00:56:49
So thank you very much. 00:56:53
Thank you. 00:56:56
Who else would like to speak? 00:57:00
I'll be very brief, Mr. Madam Chairman and members of the Board. My name is Michael Maloney. As near as I can figure, I've been 00:57:07
here on Sullivans Island since. 00:57:12
1954. 00:57:16
I remember that because my dad was complaining about. 00:57:18
Renting a house on Brook Street and having to pay $25 a week when he could have paid $75.00 for the whole month. 00:57:21
I also own a. 00:57:28
One of the units of the commissary and I'm a very active member of Stella Maris Church. One thing that's not been brought up. 00:57:30
As we go here, I was looking at the actual. 00:57:36
Bulletin and every week since I've been going to the church where God knows how many years. 00:57:40
It's clear how the machinery puts in there the requirements for someone to be married. In fact, unfortunately. 00:57:45
I have some of my relatives who were unable to get married there because they didn't meet these requirements. 00:57:51
The one other thing that I'd like to say is that Stella Maris is a very conservative church. 00:57:56
We still hold Latin masses and I love going to the Latin masses for those of you who are not Catholic. 00:58:02
That's what I grew up with as a child and it wasn't until Vatican 2 in the late. 00:58:07
1960s if we had English masses. So they're very the population, the people that are. 00:58:12
That are that really interested in traditional Catholic masses are not going to be. 00:58:17
Going to Christchurch, they're going to be looking for Stella Maris and they just aren't that many of us, unfortunately. 00:58:24
So. 00:58:30
Last week in the bulletin, I was the ecumenical minister. Week before that, I was Father Mcinerney's altar boy. 00:58:31
I'm very proud member of Stella Maris. His great institution here on the island has done a lot of good things over the years. My 00:58:37
mother and father have a bell name for them. 00:58:42
And I would strongly encourage you to approve this variance. 00:58:46
Thank you. 00:58:49
Is there anybody here to speak against the variance? 00:58:51
Well, I'm just trying to make sure that both that all sides are heard. 00:58:59
Because what I would like to do right now is if there's not anything new. 00:59:04
I would like I'm going to have you come up. 00:59:09
Don't worry, you're going to get to speak. 00:59:12
I would never leave Father McInerney. 00:59:14
Off. 00:59:16
If you are in favor of the variance, please raise your hand. 00:59:18
No. 00:59:22
Only residents. 00:59:24
Raise their hand and vote as opposed. We're not voting, I'm taking. 00:59:26
Because members of the church are here too. I'm just getting a feeling for the room. This doesn't count in our opinion, in our 00:59:30
discussions, or our opinions. I just want to see how much support there is for and against. 00:59:38
It doesn't weigh in our deliberations. 00:59:46
I just want to give everybody a chance to raise their hand if they want to, so everybody in favor of the variance. 00:59:48
OK. Thank you everybody against the variance. 00:59:56
OK, thank you. I want. I knew they were here. I just wanted to see them. 01:00:02
How many? If you are not at Sullivan's Island resident, raise your hand. 01:00:09
OK, there are a few. 01:00:15
I am going to call him Father. I'm going to close public comment with Father McInerney because we want to get to our 01:00:18
deliberations. 01:00:21
Thank you. And I did want to speak last so I could address questions that came up and so to go through some of the questions. 01:00:28
I think we settled a school issue. 01:00:34
We started a school in 1950. 01:00:36
And here on the island. And a couple years later we moved it to Mount Pleasant. 01:00:38
And as Christ our King, Stella Mayer School. 01:00:42
The question about parishioners recusing themselves? 01:00:45
My understanding is the protocol is that it's up to the parishioner to whether they feel they could. 01:00:48
Are being influenced in any negative way. 01:00:53
And actually at the last meeting, a parishioner voted to table our request. So I think that that's up to them to make that. 01:00:56
Distinction. 01:01:03
Question about monitors for the parking or other conditions. 01:01:04
In 34 years I've never had a neighbor. 01:01:08
Bring me a problem that I couldn't solve. 01:01:12
I think a lot of this is sort of hypothetical. What if? What if? 01:01:15
What if? If that happens, certainly we're going to deal with it. 01:01:18
And again, the parking issue is going to be with determined by dot. We're perfectly willing to have ingress on Osceola and egress 01:01:22
X. 01:01:27
Egress on station 12 if that's what they approve. 01:01:33
As for the increased population of the area. 01:01:36
I will say all of our parishes. 01:01:39
When Solomaris covered everything east of the Cooper. 01:01:42
We now have Christ our King which is substantially just and added on to their church. We have Saint Benedict's up Hwy. 17 N. 01:01:45
We have Saint Clair of Assisi trying to meet this. 01:01:53
Surge in the population. 01:01:57
We is kind of embarrassing to say. As a church we should be out evangelizing and recruiting. We don't even advertise. 01:01:59
And you'll see churches with the High Holy Days, Christmas, Easter advertising their services. We don't even advertise because we 01:02:06
know. 01:02:10
Of our neighborhood and the problems there. 01:02:14
And my person who registers, people will say it isn't easy and we won't try to make it hard to join. 01:02:17
But our priority goes to Solomon's Island, Isle of Palms residence. 01:02:23
And that brings me to something else. 01:02:27
About uh. 01:02:29
Than non residents and this is a point that's very dear to me. 01:02:30
Because. 01:02:34
As I have pointed out. 01:02:35
Estella Maris covered all of East Cooper. 01:02:37
We have families that come to us from Mount Pleasant. 01:02:39
Who are legacy members of Stella Maris? 01:02:42
Some grew up in Stella Maris can no longer afford to live on Sullivan's Island. Is there one contact with the with the community? 01:02:45
And as far as people coming onto the island? 01:02:52
I dare say the majority, vast majority, if not all of your town employees, the people who make this town function. 01:02:56
Do not live on Solomon's. 01:03:02
And if you have a fire? 01:03:04
Or God forbid, drowning incident or danger in this water. 01:03:06
And the volunteers come out. 01:03:10
Of the 42 volunteers. 01:03:12
41 do not live on the island, so we have to be cognizant of that. 01:03:14
There was a legal question. 01:03:19
I'm a church lawyer, I'm not a civil lawyer, but I would like to try to help. I don't know if I'm right on this about the variance 01:03:22
that. 01:03:25
Those that. 01:03:29
This umm. 01:03:30
Statement in the code that nonconformities. 01:03:31
Should not be increased in any manner. 01:03:35
I think the context has to be though. 01:03:38
That these nonconformities are residential. 01:03:40
This is for a residential area as I understand it. 01:03:42
And so if you have a second building non conforming. 01:03:45
I think that's kind of a given. 01:03:48
But this is a different situation. It's not. 01:03:50
A residential area, obviously, although it's zoned as such. 01:03:53
And so then there's the definition of. 01:03:57
Variance where a literal enforcement of the provisions of the zoning ordinance will result in unnecessary hardship. 01:04:00
And so that the spirit of the zoning ordinance shall be observed and substantial justice done. 01:04:07
And I think that has been well demonstrated. 01:04:13
That the increased size is about circulation. 01:04:15
Safety. 01:04:18
Bathroom requirements. 01:04:19
And so forth. 01:04:21
Thank you for your time. 01:04:22
OK. 01:04:26
All right, I am going to close public comment and the board is going to discuss. 01:04:28
We may ask questions of Charles and Eddie. 01:04:35
OK. 01:04:42
I have a question regarding the parking. I know that dot. 01:04:46
Does have the final say but. 01:04:50
There's some latitude in what you can propose. 01:04:53
To the dot right? 01:04:57
Right. But we did the parking lot, but I'm talking about how it relates to this, the current variance and the congestion concern. 01:04:59
I just that's just a question. 01:05:09
I don't feel like there's any. 01:05:14
Part of what's being requested tonight, these variances that. 01:05:18
Parking involved in them. 01:05:24
Right there. 01:05:26
There will be. 01:05:29
DRB Design review board. 01:05:31
Review of parking when that's brought to them. 01:05:34
And they do have. 01:05:37
There is some town control at that stage. 01:05:39
And then dot has control over the ingress and egress, and that's what we did with the special when the special exception was 01:05:43
granted last month. 01:05:47
It included. 01:05:51
Approval of that parking. 01:05:53
Of the ability to put parking. 01:05:56
And so that's. 01:05:58
Not part of this proposal. So what I see is that we're talking about traffic, which. 01:06:00
We can't control. 01:06:06
And there are very, I mean I. 01:06:08
I live. 01:06:10
Near the commercial district I've got traffic. 01:06:12
All day long so. 01:06:14
There is traffic on this island, but as some of the speakers pointed out, it's. 01:06:16
Related to Wednesday night or Wednesday services and Sunday services. 01:06:21
Which is, you know, mostly it's for most of the churches that's the same thing. So. 01:06:26
And they are trying to get. 01:06:33
Part there as far as the traffic, they're trying to get the parking off the street with more parking that will be. 01:06:34
Allowed, um. 01:06:40
Through their parking lot project. 01:06:42
Yeah, go ahead. 01:06:48
Father had a question about. I brought it up earlier with regard to. 01:06:49
Increased frequency and number of. 01:06:55
Members of the congregation that will use the new fellowship hall. 01:07:00
How do you respond to that? 01:07:04
I foresee no. 01:07:07
Radical increase. Interestingly, the best. 01:07:09
A way to track a church's membership. Is attendance actual. 01:07:12
Attendance and it has not varied that much. We have. 01:07:16
More visible crowd outside. Some of our neighbors may see that listening on an external speaker that goes back to Covic. 01:07:20
The church is so small and I think that's what limits. 01:07:27
The numbers. 01:07:30
The size of the church we are adamantly opposed to. 01:07:32
Modifying the church in any way. 01:07:35
It only seats about 250 something like that. 01:07:37
And then the room, the main room. 01:07:41
That what they're calling a meeting room in the hall where we have that one, one extra mass there. 01:07:43
While we're having 9:30 in the church, we have a 930 in the hall. 01:07:49
That is only increasing maybe. What did they say? 5 feet? 01:07:53
At the ages. 01:07:57
Is substantially the same. 01:07:58
Size room. 01:08:01
Because we're trying to accommodate what we have not, not to grow the church. So when do you use the parish hall now? And sorry if 01:08:02
I sound ignorant, I just don't know. It's hardly hardly used. I mean in the sense that the main use of this building will be 01:08:07
Sunday school. 01:08:12
That's like 2 hours on Sunday mornings nine months of the year. 01:08:17
We have like a Bible study, one of the needs in our needs assessment. 01:08:22
The biggest request we got from the parishioners was. 01:08:27
A room smaller than what we call the Large Hall. 01:08:30
The main room. 01:08:33
That could accommodate small groups like 30 people. 01:08:34
And that would accommodate. 01:08:38
Women's Club. Men's club. 01:08:39
Then we would after funerals we don't even have. We used to have lunches. 01:08:41
We can't because the hole is set up. 01:08:46
For mass now. 01:08:48
So that would accommodate that. 01:08:49
So the size of the building's. 01:08:50
As again, the public meeting area is not being expanded radically. A lot of it, as the architects pointed out, is circulation. 01:08:54
The corridors that code requires. 01:09:01
Is that answer. Thank you. 01:09:04
I want to hand the cavalier make the notion. 01:09:22
What do you think? 01:09:26
Michael. 01:09:29
You have any thoughts? 01:09:30
Well, one thought is I just. 01:09:32
Appreciate. 01:09:34
How the? 01:09:36
The church has really worked with the neighborhood from what I can see. 01:09:37
And trying to solve. 01:09:40
Issues related to the design and. 01:09:43
Limiting the building and. 01:09:46
And just taking the. 01:09:47
And the people of sullivans island into account in. 01:09:50
Kind of almost every aspect of what you're doing and I. 01:09:53
It helps me. 01:09:58
To be somewhat assured that. 01:09:59
The few problems that. 01:10:02
Were hypothetically mentioned. 01:10:04
They'll be taken care of in the future. Yeah, I just, I really appreciate what you did in your deep dive on. 01:10:07
What, what did you know? What's the major cause of the what's the use of the additional square footage and how will it be used? 01:10:14
And. 01:10:17
Taking it out to the doing the comparison, I'm glad you did the square footage comparison because I knew last time. 01:10:21
It was not going to be the largest building on Sullivan's Island because I work in one of the largest buildings. 01:10:27
But I do appreciate that you. 01:10:33
You found some to cut. You went and dove down into the explanations about. 01:10:35
About why so it makes perfect sense. 01:10:40
You know you want to be able to. 01:10:43
Have wheelchairs passed in your corridor and have handicapped accessibility for your for your common areas in your bathrooms and 01:10:45
kitchens so. 01:10:48
I do appreciate the time you took to do that. 01:10:52
To that note. 01:10:59
I would say that. 01:11:00
Everybody wants to know the answer. 01:11:02
Right, because there's a traffic dancer. There's this answer. 01:11:05
And. 01:11:09
I think that everyone in this room is looking at it. 01:11:10
At a global perspective and. 01:11:13
You know, I think that. 01:11:16
Again. 01:11:17
Part of the puzzle. 01:11:18
I think the guardrails are in place. 01:11:20
With DRB. 01:11:23
And dot. 01:11:25
To answer some of the questions that will inevitably not get answered here today. 01:11:27
But will come to. 01:11:34
Some smart resolution. As we move this thing, it will increase some of the nonconformity it is. 01:11:37
You know the other churches that are have that are zoned religious. 01:11:47
Holy Cross has three buildings on. 01:11:53
On our land. 01:11:58
Which is 3 lots that were. 01:11:59
Put together so it's three buildings, so. 01:12:01
Churches don't exist in just one building, so. 01:12:04
It's how they operate as well. 01:12:07
They've not. They have increased some of the. 01:12:10
Nonconformities. 01:12:13
Management. 01:12:19
Improve, you know, improved accessibility. 01:12:22
Umm, and so I think the, they've offset some of the, the. 01:12:25
Expansion if you will have been offset in a good way. 01:12:30
Yeah, I agree. And it appears to me that. 01:12:34
You couldn't even build the structure the way it is now, so to the extent that. 01:12:37
You know the hardship exists. You could not rebuild this in the same footprint it is now, with the limitations imposed by. 01:12:43
Safety and codes and everything else and. 01:12:51
It looks like the portion that of the expansion. 01:12:55
Is very minimal. 01:12:58
As far as the expansion of meeting space as opposed to expansion. 01:13:00
Of circulation and the ability. 01:13:05
To get around and to have safe ingress and egress from the building so. 01:13:08
I think it does create a hardship. 01:13:13
That couldn't be overcome just to. 01:13:17
Maintain the current space. So that's that's my. 01:13:19
Input on that. 01:13:22
Mr. Favor, another question is that true that you couldn't build? 01:13:24
The current structure compliant with building code in the same footprint as the existing building. 01:13:30
Or is it you could do it? 01:13:36
But you just have much less. 01:13:38
Usable space. 01:13:40
Everything inside the train. 01:13:48
Our meeting during our class completely. 01:13:49
So of course you could build it on that footprint. 01:13:52
But it would not serve as congregation and be significantly smaller. 01:13:56
And the meeting space couldn't be configured the same and the meeting space itself would be. 01:14:01
Severely restricted so you couldn't build it as is. 01:14:06
On this. 01:14:11
Yeah, right. 01:14:12
Good point. 01:14:15
Now .1 thing out about the. 01:14:17
The discussion of nonconformity. 01:14:19
So we have a non conforming condition. 01:14:22
That will go away. 01:14:25
It wouldn't be expanded. 01:14:28
By granting these variances, there would be no nonconformity. 01:14:30
Because it would be conforming based on the variances to the ordinance that would be allowing it to exist in conformity. 01:14:34
It would be. 01:14:44
By virtue of granting the variances, it would be conforming to its standard, so we would be varying the ordinance. 01:14:47
To accommodate the building the utilization of the property. 01:14:54
Thank you. 01:15:01
You want me to hand over the gavel and I do it or when y'all want to do it? 01:15:17
You gotta put a motion on the floor. 01:15:20
I want to do a much interpretation. 01:15:26
You know you can do it in my car. 01:15:32
Want me to do? 01:15:35
I'm handing over the gavel so I can make the motion. 01:15:40
Do I don't get carried away? 01:15:45
Bridget, I'm not going to repeat the whole thing. 01:15:56
I'm just gonna. 01:15:58
Basically, I'm going to make a motion to approve. 01:16:00
The variance request. 01:16:06
For 1204, Middle St. in its entirety. 01:16:08
And based on. 01:16:14
Our findings in section 21179. 01:16:19
They're extraordinary and exceptional conditions pertaining to this particular piece of property as this is and has been a 01:16:24
religious use prior to the establishment of the town's zoning ordinance. 01:16:30
These conditions do not generally apply to other property in the vicinity, so the because only the only the other church partials. 01:16:37
Parcels on the island have this distinction. 01:16:46
Because of these conditions, the application of the zoning ordinance. 01:16:50
To the particular piece of property would effectively prohibit. 01:16:53
Or unreasonably restrict the utilization of the property. 01:16:57
Because without approval of these variances, the existing parish hall would continue to deteriorate. 01:17:01
And would remain non conforming to the Rs district standards. 01:17:06
Sorry. 01:17:12
I have several pieces of paper here. 01:17:14
In addition. 01:17:19
The improvements in the non conforming setbacks and impervious coverage will enhance the neighborhood compatibility and increase 01:17:20
massing and coverage are countered by the majority of the Massings location. 01:17:26
Closer to the adjacent commercial governmental use of the Fort Moultrie Visitor Center. 01:17:31
And the increase in principal building coverage and square footage are both offset by the important reduction in impervious 01:17:36
coverage. 01:17:39
Which will allow the larger building to better address stormwater concerns in the area. 01:17:43
Rather than the existing smaller building with its asphalt parking lot. 01:17:48
And also it will improve accessibility and bathroom facilities as those are the main drivers of the increased footprint. 01:17:52
And this will enhance public safety and provide a more accommodating space for patrons, especially those with special needs. 01:17:59
Therefore, the fourth point is authorization of a variance. 01:18:07
Will not be of substantial detriment to the adjacent property or to the public good. 01:18:11
And the granting of the variance will not harm the character of the district. 01:18:15
The proposed building would enhance the visual appeal of the property, would improve on nonconformities that detract from the 01:18:19
neighborhood compatibility. 01:18:24
And would improve the handling of stormwater on the property to the benefit of the neighboring. 01:18:28
Properties. 01:18:33
Their second. 01:18:38
2nd. 01:18:39
Discussion. 01:18:43
I have no discussion. 01:18:46
All those in favor say Huh? 01:18:50
Aye. 01:18:54
I don't do that. 01:19:04
We'll take a short break, as we have. 01:19:12
There are three more items on our agenda, so you must leave quietly, please. 01:19:22
I told you most of the people will be there. 01:19:31
Now it's all nice and calm. Aren't y'all glad? 01:19:40
We got through that. 01:19:43
We are going to take the next two items on the agenda together because they are the exact same. 01:19:46
Issue. 01:19:54
We're going to bundle them. 01:19:55
1010 Osceola. 01:19:57
And 1018 Osceola requesting variances from section 2113. 01:20:00
To allow the importation of fill materials onto the lot, increasing lot elevations by. 01:20:06
More than one foot above the existing grades and from 21139 B two and three to allow a fence. 01:20:12
Made of materials other than wood or metal and to allow a fence. 01:20:18
Without any openings across its plane. Charles, please present for the town. 01:20:21
Thank you, Madam Chair. 01:20:27
As stated, this is a request for variances at the properties. 01:20:30
Adjust is 1010 and 1018 Osceola Ave. These are in the Rs zoning district. You can see these arrows are pointing to 10/18 on the 01:20:34
right and 10:10 on the left. 01:20:39
Here are postings on these properties advertising tonight's meeting. 01:20:47
And this is an elevation map showing these are. 01:20:54
Two of the lowest properties on the island. 01:20:59
Rebecca, would you care to speak to this? 01:21:03
A little bit. 01:21:05
Rebecca is our Natural Resource and Resilience Director for the Island and has helped me with some of these graphics and I'd like 01:21:07
to let her. 01:21:12
Speak to them. 01:21:16
Thank you. Yeah, looking at mean elevation of the. 01:21:18
Parcels in question that average elevation is. 01:21:23
Below the road elevation on average. 01:21:28
And you can see by that purple shading just a categorization that shows. 01:21:33
That many of the parcels around it are also very low. 01:21:39
And if you will. 01:21:44
Yes, thank you. 01:21:47
And this is important to note for this particular portion of the island as it. 01:21:50
Holds into the stormwater master plan that was adopted by council. 01:21:55
And drafted by Seaman and Whiteside. 01:22:00
And here we can see. 01:22:02
That if we did nothing, if we made no stormwater improvements, then in 50 years. 01:22:05
A high tide and a foot of rain would do this to that neighborhood. 01:22:11
So that is just sort of the flood model prediction of what that neighborhood would look like in 2075 with 100 year rain at high 01:22:16
tide. 01:22:20
But if the town is able to achieve its storm water master plan, then. 01:22:26
We would see that much of the flooding would be resolved for those low properties that are between or on the. 01:22:33
Beachside of Osceola Ave. and that's because Osceola Ave. would have been raised according to this plan. 01:22:43
To an elevation of 6 feet or 7 feet high. 01:22:50
And possibly doing that in stages. 01:22:56
Because that's a lot of. 01:22:59
Grade raised for a road to go from about four and a half feet high. 01:23:02
To six feet high is already a big step, and then to get it even up to 7 feet high based on. 01:23:07
Some of the predictions of sea level and rain. 01:23:12
Of the future. 01:23:17
That would sort of be the direction we would be heading and that would leave that whole neighborhood there between ocean and the 01:23:19
marsh. 01:23:22
Out of the protection plan for that neighborhood, so. 01:23:26
If we go to the next slide, we'll see. 01:23:30
What those properties look like, there's fourteen in total. 01:23:33
That would not be protected by. 01:23:37
The the Osceola Rd. being raised or the storm water drainage improvements to the piping system in that neighborhood either. 01:23:40
And if we look at the ten lowest properties on average on the island. 01:23:50
Then we would see that there are a few of them. 01:23:56
In the immediate vicinity. 01:24:01
And the two in question today are and 2nd and 4th place. 01:24:03
Respectively. 01:24:08
Thank you, Rebecca. 01:24:13
And then looking specifically at what's being requested. 01:24:15
For you today, this is. 01:24:20
At 10:10 Osceola Ave. This is the. 01:24:22
Survey from 2000. You can see the OCRM. 01:24:26
Critical line right here. 01:24:31
And then this is the proposed plan. 01:24:33
For this property with the. 01:24:36
This wall basically following the OCRM critical line just on the. 01:24:39
Landward side of that. 01:24:44
And then I've color-coded the. 01:24:48
Property. So everything in this pink is. 01:24:50
Areas of the existing grade that are below 4 feet. 01:24:54
In the blue we have areas of existing grade that are between 4:00 and 5:00 feet. 01:24:59
In the green it is the areas between 5:00 and 6:00 feet and then this small little hill. 01:25:05
Which we can see back in those previous slides. 01:25:12
Is the area that's about 6 feet. 01:25:16
And then if you look at these contour lines, these are the proposed fill for this lot. 01:25:20
Umm, with much of the. 01:25:27
The fill going on the. 01:25:29
Interior side of the wall, kind of creating a slope up to the. 01:25:31
The wall that would be proposed. 01:25:36
And then? 01:25:39
Out here in the front yard, a lot of fill over. 01:25:40
In some places 2 1/2 feet of fill would be added to this lot. 01:25:44
A little bit more in some other areas. 01:25:47
Looking next door at 10:18. 01:25:55
Seal Ave. This is. 01:25:58
The This is a house that is currently under construction. 01:26:00
And this is the approved site plan for this property. 01:26:05
And you can see that they were. 01:26:10
Approved working within the grades of the existing property. 01:26:13
And this is the proposed plan which. 01:26:17
Again, shows a wall right inside of the critical line. 01:26:20
And we've got grades. 01:26:24
Up to the grading, grading, up to the building pad in this case, and then down away into. 01:26:27
Storm water drains on either side of the. 01:26:35
Backyard. 01:26:38
That would outflow into the marsh. 01:26:39
Through 6 inch conduits. 01:26:42
And then grading down into elevated ditches along the Osceola Ave. 01:26:44
You can see the. 01:26:50
Proposed elevations are about 6 1/2 feet. 01:26:51
On the edge of the slab. 01:26:55
Which is. 01:26:59
Contrary to what was approved, it was approved at a 5 1/2 foot slabs of their. 01:27:02
Some questions to whether that would work having the fill go higher than the slab. 01:27:06
This is the approved storm water plan for this property. 01:27:15
I've highlighted on this the. 01:27:21
Line. That's the limits of moderate wave action. 01:27:24
It's an area that. 01:27:27
C Word of this line, there are special requirements for construction. 01:27:32
Typically the. 01:27:38
Construction requirements are that of a visa. 01:27:40
There's question as to whether or not. 01:27:45
Landscape fill would be prohibited. 01:27:47
Seaward of the Lenoir Line and. 01:27:51
I think DES or OCM would need to approve. 01:27:55
And he fell on the. 01:27:58
Water side the up. 01:28:01
The top side of this. 01:28:04
Map where there's a lot of fill being proposed if we look at the previous slide. 01:28:06
This has us up at 5:00. 01:28:11
5 1/2 feet 575 for the drop inlets. 01:28:15
Where's the critical line on that line? 01:28:20
If you look just outside of the. 01:28:22
Got it. OK, I see it. That's the critical line with the wall just on the inside of the critical line. 01:28:25
And on the. 01:28:34
Approved plan. 01:28:36
You can see the critical line right here. 01:28:37
And that's. 01:28:43
Three years ago. When does that critical line get redrawn? 01:28:45
It would it would be redrawn it. 01:28:51
The final survey for as built survey. 01:28:54
They would they would be retaliating it at that time. 01:28:57
One other thing to point out. 01:29:01
You know this plan that is being shown to y'all tonight? 01:29:04
Has not been. 01:29:09
Through staff review. 01:29:12
One thing I would note. 01:29:15
As the approved plan has a small driveway. 01:29:17
This has a much larger driveway that wraps around the side of the house. None of this has been. 01:29:21
Reviewed or vetted and approved by staff. At this point, this was the first time that we've seen this plan. 01:29:28
Was during this uh. 01:29:34
Variance request. So this is This is what is approved. 01:29:36
This driveway right here. 01:29:40
So the requests are for the importation of more than a foot of. 01:29:45
Fell over the existing grade. 01:29:52
On both both of these two lots. 01:29:55
Some areas up to 2 1/2 feet of fill. 01:29:57
Are being proposed. 01:29:59
And then defense regulations. 01:30:01
Currently walls are not a permitted thing, so. 01:30:05
The only real way. 01:30:09
Achieve a wall is through a variance to the fence requirements. Umm. 01:30:11
Which require a fence to be 25% open and that that is intended to allow breezes and visual flow. 01:30:17
Into properties. 01:30:26
And then the needed materials to create a. 01:30:28
Seawall would would not be. 01:30:32
What we would. 01:30:36
Typically find an offense. 01:30:37
What are their proposed materials? 01:30:39
We do not actually know the proposed materials. 01:30:41
So there are 4 variants. 01:30:49
Finding findings of hardship that must be present in order to grant a variance. 01:30:52
These are that they're extraordinary exceptional conditions pertaining to the particular piece of property. 01:30:59
These conditions did not generally apply to other properties. 01:31:05
In the vicinity and because of these conditions, the application of the zoning ordinance to the particular piece of property would 01:31:09
effectively. 01:31:13
Prohibit or unreasonably restrict the utilization of the property. 01:31:16
And the authorization of the variance will not be of substantial detriment to adjacent property or to the public good, and the 01:31:20
granting of the variance will not harm the character of the district. 01:31:25
It seems that I'm missing a slide. 01:31:32
That's odd, I'm going to look for it in another place. 01:31:39
With apologies. 01:31:43
Interesting. 01:31:49
I'm sorry. 01:31:52
Umm. 01:31:53
What can I say? 01:31:59
Let me just say that. 01:32:03
Staff does does not feel that. 01:32:06
Go back to that slide with the. 01:32:10
Yeah, that was lovely. 01:32:16
So I do believe. 01:32:21
Her staff does believe that there are extraordinary exceptional conditions related to these pieces of property. 01:32:23
They are very low and their elevation is below that of the. 01:32:29
Crown of the Street. 01:32:34
And such there. 01:32:36
There are conditions that generally do not apply outside of this very. 01:32:38
Small vicinity of parcels. 01:32:43
However. 01:32:46
There there is not a finding that the application of. 01:32:48
The zoning ordinance will prohibit or unreasonably restrict the utilization of the property that. 01:32:54
You know one house has been there for 100 years as. 01:33:01
Still utilized. 01:33:05
Well, and there may be. 01:33:07
Other alternative means by which to protect the property from rising waters. 01:33:08
And the other house is currently under construction. 01:33:13
And such that. 01:33:18
It seems that someone felt it was. 01:33:20
A viable place to build a nice home. 01:33:22
And plans to utilize it and I think that they certainly are able to. 01:33:25
Without the granting of a variance. 01:33:30
To the fourth point. 01:33:33
It may be of substantial detriment to the public good and to the public trust doctrine to build a. 01:33:36
Wall against the edge of the critical line. 01:33:45
Thereby, umm. 01:33:48
Tearing away Marsh. 01:33:51
Through umm. 01:33:53
Reflection of waves along that wall. 01:33:55
During high tides. 01:33:58
And scouring at the edges of the wall on adjacent properties that would. 01:34:00
Remove property from the adjacent properties. 01:34:06
High ground. 01:34:10
What that staff does not recommend approval of this variance request. 01:34:11
I apologize for that slide being missing. 01:34:16
No problem. OK. Any questions for Charles before we hear from that? 01:34:19
Closely are in that a say in. 01:34:24
With a virtual wall. 01:34:27
I believe that they do as far as. 01:34:32
Being in the Lomo. 01:34:34
And, umm. 01:34:36
Being a structure that. 01:34:38
Reflect waves potentially negatively impacting the marsh and the adjacent properties. Yes, it would be something that OCRM would 01:34:40
need to approve. 01:34:44
And then so the idea is, what are they looking? 01:34:50
Because. 01:34:53
The stormwater plan. 01:34:53
And the raising of the road will make lots more vulnerable. 01:34:56
That that is the proposed reason and I would point out. 01:35:03
When we look back at Rebecca's. 01:35:08
Slide. 01:35:11
Which actually comes from ceiling lights out of this data. 01:35:13
This is the proposed condition if Osceola were improved. 01:35:17
And elevated. 01:35:21
If you look at these two lots and then we'll go to the. 01:35:23
Condition if the road is not elevated. 01:35:27
It really does not impact. 01:35:30
The level of flooding on these. 01:35:33
Properties. 01:35:36
They will flood in either scenario. 01:35:38
And I. 01:35:42
Can you give us a little bit more information about, I mean, we're working on the storm water plan and so. 01:35:44
And see, it's not set yet. I mean we have some. 01:35:50
Some more work on the on the plan to do. 01:35:54
Excuse me to do and get it accomplished. 01:35:56
Before 2020. 01:35:59
75 when it. 01:36:00
I won't be here. We've approved this plan. 01:36:02
And it will be funded in phases, as we can get grants that fund these projects. 01:36:06
We have not. 01:36:13
Sought a grant to elevate Osceola yet and. 01:36:15
Do not have that on the. 01:36:20
One plate currently, but you think the impact on the lots would be? 01:36:23
From a lot of perspective. 01:36:31
I think. 01:36:34
It would not. 01:36:35
Be a terribly impactful change for these lots. It would still. 01:36:38
Flood umm. 01:36:43
I think that that. 01:36:44
It's hard to say for sure, but I'll ask Rebecca too. 01:36:47
Sure. Yeah, there. And excuse me, I'm a little hard of hearing, I had a hard time hearing your question, but I think I understood. 01:36:50
New stormwater plan and the raising of Osceola. 01:37:01
Goes into effect right? There would actually be little to no change in flooding for the lots on the marsh side of Osceola. 01:37:05
As a result of that. 01:37:14
Project as far as tidal flood water level. 01:37:16
Any unintended impact? 01:37:20
Groundwater. 01:37:23
Or stormwater flooding would need to be thoroughly assessed to reduce impacts to adjacent properties at the time. 01:37:25
That that road project was pursued. 01:37:33
Yeah, they send the storm water somewhere, right? 01:37:37
Yeah, yeah, OK. 01:37:39
Yes. 01:37:42
Yes. 01:37:44
The smaller existing house. 01:37:45
Very close to the ground. 01:37:47
As it is right now. 01:37:51
Correct. 01:37:52
2 feet. 01:37:54
Is it? 01:37:56
So. 01:37:58
Require at that point raising the structure. 01:38:00
The the actual proposal is to raise the grade around that house. 01:38:03
See the. 01:38:13
The proposal is to elevate the edge. 01:38:14
Along the the wall. So to draw water back in, collect it between the. 01:38:17
Wall and the house and then outfall it. 01:38:24
I believe. 01:38:27
I'm not sure that that's. 01:38:30
The best outcome for the House, I think that. 01:38:31
I think that raising the house a couple of feet would be a better solution. 01:38:34
Ultimately, yes, for this for the structure itself. 01:38:40
Earthworks that. 01:38:45
To alleviate. 01:38:48
That are potentially immediate that situation correct property. 01:38:50
I don't know what it's like in a ticket or something. 01:38:55
But one would assume that. 01:39:00
Since it has a building permit above. 01:39:02
A squad and you know there's no issue. 01:39:05
Yeah, it's on a. 01:39:09
Is it on the floating? 01:39:10
What's the? 01:39:12
OK. 01:39:14
But yeah, it. 01:39:16
It was approved. 01:39:19
The first floor is elevated. 01:39:22
Above. 01:39:25
And nobody can really say. 01:39:26
But they're raising us know what happened? 01:39:29
Next year or 25 years ago? 01:39:31
Correct. 01:39:33
I do think it is a plan and it is something that the town. 01:39:34
We don't has has a. 01:39:38
The audience has a goal of achieving. 01:39:40
I'm going to ask a question. 01:39:45
What? 01:39:47
Is the result. 01:39:51
If we. 01:39:52
A hypothetically approved the fill and didn't approve the seawall. 01:39:54
I'm calling it a seawall, whatever it is, a seawall. 01:40:00
On the marsh. 01:40:03
Or is it? Or is this bound together for some? 01:40:05
Reason that I would not be aware of. 01:40:08
It is not bound together. 01:40:10
I would think from the engineer's perspective they are bound together. 01:40:15
Just a question. Yeah, but I would. 01:40:20
Perhaps that's a question to ask the. 01:40:24
The engineer applicant if if. 01:40:26
There would be a possibility to. 01:40:29
Build 1 without the other. 01:40:31
But I think it would need to be re engineered if you're. 01:40:33
If you want my opinion. 01:40:35
I I want to be I want clarification that the. 01:40:41
Drawing that's being presented to us is not. 01:40:44
What's actually approved to be built? 01:40:49
As far as the. 01:40:51
Driveway and. 01:40:53
You just said that that's correct. The approved plan is on the left. The is that what they've submitted the right on with the 01:40:56
application. This was submitted with the application. 01:41:01
I have a question are the? 01:41:11
Basically the building condition, general conditions. 01:41:13
On the lot that's not being built on, are they similar? 01:41:16
To the lot that have. 01:41:21
They're going to construct on, in other words. 01:41:23
Would a structure be approved to be put on that? 01:41:27
That lot. 01:41:31
On the. 01:41:32
The 1010 lot, yeah. 01:41:34
Yes. 01:41:37
It's a buildable lot. 01:41:38
It has a historic house on it today. 01:41:40
And then there was a house on this lot prior to a construction that was torn down and this. 01:41:43
New homes nearing completion. 01:41:49
Removing the historical house? No, Sir. 01:41:52
No, Sir. 01:41:55
No, they would have to get a separate driveway permit. 01:42:04
That is, I'll say right now I'm not going to do anything. 01:42:08
I. 01:42:17
The interview. 01:42:22
I believe it's being proposed as a pervious. 01:42:27
What correct? 01:42:30
Yes, I can learn to not approve anything. 01:42:32
Form the planning. 01:42:37
That is not going through staff and he has been free. 01:42:39
For the expansion of blackout, which may be for committees. 01:42:44
It's says it's proposed as pervious but. 01:42:50
We don't. 01:42:55
We have not reviewed it. 01:42:58
Can't prove. 01:43:05
A request for plan that. 01:43:07
In my opinion, but I don't think that's what we're being asked to approve. 01:43:12
Tonight as far as the driveway is concerned. 01:43:20
Crap. 01:43:23
Approved improvements to Earth. 01:43:25
Approve a project on this lot. 01:43:29
With a plan. 01:43:32
I just had a problem. 01:43:35
This is this is going back. 01:43:37
Things used to come to us before they've been completely vetted. 01:43:40
And we approved something that. 01:43:43
Let's go ahead and hear from that. 01:43:50
Please say your name please. 01:43:59
Good evening. I'm Jay Harper. I'm the contractor for 10/18 Osceola that is currently under construction. 01:44:03
Kind of representing Robert Eversold, my client, and Mary Mueller next door. 01:44:10
For I'm going to give you a little bit of the why, and then Kevin is here from Steven Whiteside to give you the science of how we 01:44:17
ended up at this plan. 01:44:20
The the the. 01:44:26
The quick back story is that. 01:44:28
During construction between when the house was demoed, the previous house was demolished where we got to. 01:44:30
We had some significant flooding events in. 01:44:37
What we're talking about is tidal flooding, not not water, not rain. 01:44:42
Or anything. 01:44:46
And, umm. 01:44:47
Got married, who is 94 years old and lives at 1010 Osceola. 01:44:50
The nicest lady you'll ever meet. 01:44:57
And and I kind of developed a friendship through construction. 01:45:00
And Jennifer, her daughter here. 01:45:03
And I. 01:45:06
Started talking in October of last year. 01:45:08
About. 01:45:13
What we could do, because at that point there is a couple of. 01:45:14
Storm and tide events that. 01:45:20
Prevented Mary from being able to access her property. 01:45:23
The majority of the tide. 01:45:26
Comes up the drainage ditch between the homes and the street. 01:45:28
Crosses over the street, floods the street, and the entire street is flooded at significant tides. Not a normal high tide, but at 01:45:34
a normal high tide it is. 01:45:38
It is in the drainage ditch over our driveways and you have to drive through. 01:45:42
Or walk through water to access the homes. 01:45:47
At that same time was when the preliminary site or the preliminary master plan came out from Steven Whiteside in October. 01:45:53
And we saw where the the proposed plan was to raise the street. 01:46:02
We kind of thought. 01:46:08
Now is the time to do something about this. 01:46:09
We talked with some people from the town. 01:46:12
We engaged Seaman Whiteside on a preliminary basis. 01:46:14
What can we do? What should we do? 01:46:20
And. 01:46:22
Kind of got the ball rolling with. 01:46:25
Getting surveys done. 01:46:27
The survey on 10/18 Osceola was certified by the state on. 01:46:29
May 26, 2022. 01:46:34
The one for 1010, Osceola was certified in December of last year when we had it resurveyed. 01:46:36
That's why you see the big kind of jut in in between the two properties that was not there previous, because that's what the OCR 01:46:41
online changed. 01:46:45
Through the course of working through the town plan. 01:46:54
The I believe it was 14 properties were essentially left out of what the town is doing to. 01:46:58
Address flooding in the areas. 01:47:05
And from the plan that the town accepted, I realized there's some questions about whether it's funded or not. But. 01:47:09
You know, this is what the town has put forward as what they're going to do. 01:47:17
The the plan the language changed, but in the one that actually got adopted on March 18th, 2025 said that the town should 01:47:22
encourage and allow property owners. 01:47:26
To fill and protect their properties. 01:47:31
Against an appropriate title mitigation target. 01:47:34
And it goes on to set that target at 7 feet. 01:47:37
Which is the final goal of where to get Osceola Ave. at? 01:47:40
Quickly to. 01:47:47
Talk about the. 01:47:49
The Tanning Osceola site plan being a little different. 01:47:50
Once we realized and we started talking with Semen Whiteside. 01:47:54
The reason that the driveway area changed is originally we were talking about culverting and filling that area to create parking. 01:47:59
Which we would be allowed to do. 01:48:08
But that would not work with what? 01:48:10
Would happen in the future. 01:48:13
So part of what our plan. 01:48:15
Did was adapt to that? This is adapted several times over the course of finalizing. 01:48:19
The the town's plan. 01:48:25
And the meeting with the resiliency team which gave us some feedback at their last meeting here, which we changed our plan again 01:48:28
after that. 01:48:32
We moved the driving the parking area which is pervious. 01:48:39
Onto the the properties because that last. 01:48:43
Part of the right away at the street is basically becoming sacrificial. 01:48:47
It's going to fill with water at the high tide until. 01:48:51
The town is able to implement part of their plan. 01:48:55
At the end. 01:48:58
Of Mary's property at 1010 Osceola. 01:49:00
Part of that actually extends over into what I think is town property, but it's off of her property line. 01:49:04
And the master plan calls for some work to be done there on the town's behalf to prevent the water from back flowing up into that 01:49:09
property. 01:49:13
And until that is done, there's not a lot we can do there that the plan is to plant some grasses that will help absorb, help keep 01:49:19
the. 01:49:22
The the natural drainage from eroding. 01:49:27
And I'm sorry, I'll let Kevin get into that. 01:49:29
My understanding was that we needed to get. 01:49:33
An approval on the fill. 01:49:36
So that we have the parameters. 01:49:38
That we can finalize our site plan with that would then come to the town for approval. 01:49:40
Because if we don't get approval for the fill. 01:49:46
Our overall site plan is going to have to look. 01:49:49
A lot different than what this is. 01:49:52
So in order for us to know what we can do, we have to know what we're allowed to do. 01:49:54
And with that, I'm going to turn it over to Kevin from Steven Whiteside, who can talk about the science of stuff. 01:49:58
Hello everybody, Kevin Heron, engineer at Semen Whiteside. 01:50:10
Drafted the. 01:50:14
Grading and drainage plant. 01:50:16
For the two sites. 01:50:17
And produce the technical memorandum that was provided in the application. 01:50:19
I wanted to start with. 01:50:25
1010 Osceola. 01:50:26
Kind of separated them. 01:50:27
Is there a separate applications? 01:50:29
I'll start with why the project is necessary. 01:50:32
So, 1010 Osceola is a nationally registered historic home. 01:50:35
Built in the late 1800s. 01:50:41
One of the oldest and lowest lying properties north of the island. 01:50:43
The property sits directly adjacent to the open marsh. 01:50:48
On the left side. 01:50:51
And behind property. 01:50:53
With no form of flood protection. 01:50:55
Making it severely at risk for repetitive tidal flooding. 01:50:57
Now within the past two years. 01:51:00
There have been extreme tide events. 01:51:02
That have completely flooded Osceola Ave. 01:51:04
Which I had pictures in my tech memo. 01:51:07
You guys have seen? 01:51:09
Yeah, and. 01:51:12
OK. And I also had this other photo. 01:51:14
That I wanted to share if I could. 01:51:17
Of 10/10. 01:51:20
I could bring it up. 01:51:22
Yeah, just. 01:51:35
And that was just during an extreme high tide event within the past two years. 01:51:39
So this leaves the homeowner and emergency emergency vehicles unable to access the driveway. 01:51:44
And the SO, the recently adopted Stormwater Master Plan, outlines recommendations for the flood mitigation projects. 01:51:49
Noting the raising of Osceola as the highest priority project. 01:51:56
To an elevation of seven feet. 01:52:02
And. 01:52:04
What was shown in the presentation shows that. 01:52:05
It will help in England. 01:52:08
Flooding, but it will leave these properties on the island essentially. 01:52:10
And recommends that the property owners provide lot level grading. 01:52:15
And fill to prevent flooding in their properties. 01:52:18
So what the project is on 10/10? 01:52:23
So the installation of the landscape. 01:52:26
Across the neck of the property, along the critically. 01:52:28
The state certified critical wetland limits. 01:52:32
And the top of the wall is for. 01:52:35
Proposed at 7 feet. 01:52:37
To meet that final target elevation. 01:52:38
Stated. 01:52:41
Stormwater Master. 01:52:43
And also surrounding communities such as Iowa Palms. 01:52:44
Pawleys Island. 01:52:48
And Folly Beach, which I've also mentioned, targeting elevations of 6 1/2 to 7 feet. 01:52:49
The grated berm was evaluated at 1010 Osceola Ave. 01:52:56
But due to the existing grades in the backyard. 01:53:00
At the critical wetland. 01:53:04
And the space between that and the home. 01:53:06
There's no feasible. 01:53:09
Proper way to grade A? 01:53:11
In this area. 01:53:13
If we could go back to that. 01:53:15
Plan. 01:53:17
So as you can see in the back of the back of the home, there's very, very minimal space between. 01:53:20
The actual structure. 01:53:25
And the critical wetland line. 01:53:27
Leaving us with. 01:53:30
Landscape wall as the. 01:53:32
Feasible alternative? 01:53:34
To prevent flooding from the marshland side. 01:53:36
Which is all elevation based. 01:53:39
And the remainder of the site. 01:53:42
Was graded to 6 and 6 1/2 along the wall within the property. 01:53:45
The grading will. 01:53:49
Produce flow not towards the foundation of the building, but towards that yard inlet in the back. 01:53:50
To be discharged into the marsh. 01:53:56
So that was taken into consideration. 01:53:58
Integrating plan. 01:54:00
Because of the overall goal is to prevent. 01:54:02
Structural damage to the historic property in the home. 01:54:05
Continue to be usable. 01:54:08
And so if nothing is done to this property even after the town's Osceola project. 01:54:11
The property will continue to repetitively flood as you see in the picture there. 01:54:17
With intensity projected to increase in the future, these title. 01:54:22
Floods will continue to rise in elevation. 01:54:26
And. 01:54:28
Regardless of Osceola, raising the marshland behind would still be. 01:54:30
Flooding towards. 01:54:36
The property. 01:54:38
Kind of leaving it. 01:54:39
On an island, as I mentioned from from the flood mitigation. 01:54:41
That would be provided by the Osceola Raising Project. 01:54:45
Now, by performing these improvements, the property owner can sleep at night knowing that. 01:54:49
At least our driveway will be accessible by them and emergency vehicles in flood scenarios. 01:54:54
And that their home and foundation will be better protected from flooding. 01:54:59
For the next 50 years. 01:55:03
So I was going to move to 10/18. 01:55:07
Yes, that's right. 01:55:10
Sorry, landscape wall so. 01:55:15
I would like to know what are the materials of this seawall that's being proposed. 01:55:17
Yeah, it's a seawall. 01:55:23
I would have to. 01:55:27
It's a boy, it's a wood, but we're professing. 01:55:28
Thank you. 01:55:31
Thanks. 01:55:33
And how long has the individual owned? 01:55:36
Sorry, since the 1950s. 01:55:41
I I. 01:55:46
I'll go ahead. 01:55:54
I grew up across the street from the Muller's. 01:55:56
OK, on King Street. 01:55:59
Yeah. So we've, I've known them for a long time, Yeah. 01:56:01
What happens if you are alive but until the not be well, yeah. 01:56:06
The. 01:56:11
Tidal elevations will continue to rise, and the fill will eventually become. 01:56:13
Unsustainable and won't do the job. It won't prevent flooding. 01:56:19
In the property. 01:56:22
Just because like I mentioned, the minimal amounts of space. 01:56:23
Between the marsh. 01:56:26
Which the town has no jurisdiction in the marsh, so it kind of leaves. 01:56:27
The town's drainage improvements to be within the public right of way. 01:56:32
Hence the Osceola project. 01:56:36
And so these specific properties. 01:56:38
Are almost forced to do the improvements, lot level improvements by themselves. 01:56:41
Yeah, well, the town can't. 01:56:52
Tide from coming up the back. I mean, that's just not, I mean, you can't, you can't mitigate that. Yeah. 01:56:54
Yeah, you can move on to 10/18. 01:57:03
OK, please. 01:57:05
So the the. 01:57:07
Reasoning for the project is very similar, synonymous to 10/10. 01:57:08
During construction over the last two years became evident that improvements were needed when these. 01:57:13
Extreme high tide events that we're currently experiencing, we're reaching up to the new foundation elevation, basically flooding. 01:57:19
The entire property up to this level. 01:57:24
And these title events are only expected to increase over the next 50 years, as noted in the master plan. 01:57:27
So the design you see now at 1018 is after multiple iterations of revisions. 01:57:33
With feedback from the town. 01:57:38
The Brazilians team and the neighboring properties. 01:57:40
The installation of the landscape. 01:57:45
Across the back of the property continues to follow the shape of the. 01:57:47
Critical wetland line. 01:57:50
It was pulled in 3 1/2 feet. 01:57:52
To provide a. 01:57:54
Sorry A. 01:57:58
An area for plantings and slight rating. 01:58:02
Up to. 01:58:06
To the wall between the critical limit line and the landscape wall. 01:58:07
And the top of the wall is proposed elevation 7 in order to meet that same target elevation for tidal protection. 01:58:12
That I've spoken about. 01:58:18
So what's so let me ask a question. You talked this. 01:58:21
7 foot wall. 01:58:24
The elevation of seven feet. Sorry, elevation of seven feet. 01:58:27
So, umm. 01:58:32
By more than one foot above existing grade, you're going to say anything more specific than more than one foot? 01:58:33
Does that mean you could put in 2 1/2 or 4? 01:58:41
What's What's your maximum? 01:58:46
Amount of. 01:58:48
It's right around 2 1/2 feet. 01:58:50
As shown in the presentation that Charles provided. 01:58:52
OK. That would have to limit. OK the front, right? 01:58:55
Is the lowest part of the property where the most amount of total go. 01:58:58
And how much is that? 01:59:03
I think it's a little under 2 1/2. It's over 2. 01:59:05
When at that, when we get our high tides. 01:59:08
I'm just looking at. I don't want to approve anything that says. 01:59:13
More than one foot. 01:59:17
I'll approve the less than 2 1/2 feet, but not a more than one foot. 01:59:21
Because then we have absolutely you could come in and put 5 feet on there and. 01:59:26
We would have. 01:59:31
Yeah, OK. 01:59:32
We like specificity on the Board of Zoning Appeals. 01:59:34
So you were talking about. You need to know about the. 01:59:38
Whether we can get a? 01:59:41
Approval on the fill in order to. 01:59:43
I think my words go to the next. 01:59:45
Step and that was my understanding. I could have been taking in one of our meetings of the town. My understanding was that. 01:59:47
Getting a PCA through or a PCA approval for being able to bring in. 01:59:56
Built. It's going to dictate what our final plan ends up being. 02:00:02
Do you also need to know? 02:00:06
Whether you have approval on the wall? 02:00:08
After seeing Whiteside got involved with the burn not working. 02:00:12
Our original plan. 02:00:17
Had more extensive walls that got changed. 02:00:20
The reason it juts out on the right side and comes back is because the neighbors have an existing wall. 02:00:23
That we are attempting to tie into to prevent sour. 02:00:29
Do that is why you see that line? 02:00:33
Out there. So that way we're going to have a continuous wall. 02:00:37
Microphone. 02:00:41
What is their wall made of? 02:00:44
Oh, you need to turn your microphone on. 02:00:45
Yeah, you need to be at the microphone if you're going to talk. That's my fault. I was asking you questions. 02:00:50
Just from what I can see it is masonry brick and block. 02:00:55
And. 02:01:01
There are. 02:01:03
Varying elevations of it. 02:01:05
The because it has part of it has deteriorated. 02:01:07
But that's what we're attempting to tie into that so that. 02:01:12
You know, inevitably they're going to need. 02:01:16
To address their properties in similar ways. 02:01:19
We need the continuous line kind of coming around the back to protect everybody or none of this. Does anybody any good? 02:01:23
I was not aware there was a. 02:01:32
Structure on the back of that block next to it. 02:01:35
Is it a? 02:01:38
Obviously. 02:01:41
Did we know about it? 02:01:43
Is it illegal? 02:01:44
Is it non conforming? 02:01:46
Would it be allowed to be rebuilt without coming before us? 02:01:48
Are we going to set a precedent? 02:01:52
These are all my questions. 02:01:54
We know very little about that. 02:01:56
Structure. I do see it shown on this plan. 02:01:59
But I'm yeah, I saw the jet out there and I couldn't figure out what it was for. But my guess is it predates our ordinances. 02:02:03
Oh, I'm sure it does. Yeah, yeah. 02:02:11
Old structure. 02:02:13
But I don't know. But it was still not really allowed. 02:02:15
I supposedly. 02:02:22
OK. 02:02:25
Keep going with your. 02:02:27
Proposal. 02:02:29
OK. Thank you. 02:02:31
So the. 02:02:33
The drainage improvements also include two dry wells in the back of the property. 02:02:35
With yard piping. 02:02:41
Inlets and grading to capture and retain runoff within the property, that was one of our main goals here. 02:02:42
The intent of this design is to minimize impact. 02:02:48
An additional runoff from 10/18 to either neighboring property. 02:02:51
As mentioned in the. 02:02:55
Technical memo with the application. 02:02:57
23% of 1018 Osceola Ave. 02:02:59
Currently drains towards 20/10/26. 02:03:03
To the right here. 02:03:06
And approximately 20% flows towards 1010. 02:03:07
And then after these improvements are made. 02:03:10
Those would both be reduced to 3%. 02:03:14
So that we're essentially. 02:03:16
Flow to the marsh. 02:03:17
Capturing the flow and discharging to the marsh, yes. 02:03:18
On the sidewalk on the pervious paved sidewalk on the 10:26. 02:03:22
Side of the property. 02:03:27
Will act as. 02:03:28
We have the yard analyst directly in the center of the. 02:03:30
Sidewalk and it's it's going to drain towards the back of the property instead of allowing sheet flow to run towards. 02:03:34
10/26. 02:03:40
Is that a sidewalk? 02:03:42
Gravel path? Yes. Peruse. 02:03:46
Gravel path. 02:03:47
There's no, sorry, there's no driveway that comes around the side of the property. That's just the walk pass that. 02:03:49
OK, the way it's presented it looks like. 02:03:55
It's a similar. 02:03:59
Pervious material. 02:04:01
That is. 02:04:02
Made to catch all the catch all the water diverted back to drywalls which have pumps. 02:04:05
To pump out, it's not, we're not relying just on a check valve, Right, right. OK. Yeah, yeah. 02:04:12
And so that was part of your drainage system basically. 02:04:20
And with 1010 unable to utilize a grated berm. 02:04:25
And 1026 having the existing seawall. 02:04:29
1018 would be at risk of continued. 02:04:32
Wave action between the two properties if the wall wasn't provided in the back of 10/18. 02:04:35
This will allow for a singular rigid structure between the two properties. 02:04:40
Minimizing potential future issues. 02:04:44
I'm not just concerned about the neighboring property, I'm concerned about the marsh. 02:04:46
Killing the marsh. 02:04:52
Behind a sea wall, that's what happens. 02:04:54
And Marsh is our friend. 02:04:57
Yes. 02:04:59
And the. 02:05:00
Living shoreline design that we added to 10/18. 02:05:02
There's a detail on the third sheet which. 02:05:06
Didn't end up in the presentation, but it. 02:05:08
It shows the. 02:05:10
Marsh side plantings and the grading. 02:05:12
Within town code under 1 foot. 02:05:15
Up to the base of the wall. 02:05:18
I have a print out of the plans if. 02:05:21
That will help. 02:05:23
Hold on. 02:05:24
And that was after discussions with the resilience team. 02:05:27
Right there in the bottom right, yes. 02:05:34
So. 02:05:37
And may ask just a general question so. 02:05:50
We're talking about these two properties, but we've identified. 02:05:54
Sort of 14 properties that are sort of in a similar situation. 02:05:57
Tell us what the downside is to the other. 02:06:04
Adjacent 12 parcels if there isn't a wall that continues along there. 02:06:07
Is there a downside? 02:06:13
This wall wouldn't. 02:06:15
Produce any. 02:06:16
Additional flood risks for the neighboring properties to the to the. 02:06:18
Northeast. 02:06:23
14 other properties. 02:06:24
They would have to produce the lot level improvements similar to 10:10 and 10:18. 02:06:25
To prevent the. 02:06:30
Flood risks moving forward. 02:06:32
Presumably if. 02:06:37
We did this. 02:06:39
We would get 12 other. 02:06:41
Applications. 02:06:43
Yeah. 02:06:45
That's the problem. 02:06:47
And when that happens? 02:06:51
I don't care how much you try and mitigate. 02:06:53
Having planting. 02:06:56
The tide is still going to take that, I mean. 02:06:58
Yeah, yeah. But that lot's going to be unusual. 02:07:02
We would have to make. We would have. 02:07:07
Yeah, we. 02:07:10
Yes, 1010 is going to be unusable. 02:07:12
And 10:18 should maybe be protected to help 10/10. 02:07:16
But we, we would, if we approve this, we would have to be really, really specific about. 02:07:21
There's no other No2 lots next to each other like this we're. 02:07:27
Well, yeah, because, because if we approve a. 02:07:32
Call it a. 02:07:37
Landscape wall or whatever, it's a seawall if we approve that. 02:07:38
Everybody else is going to want one. 02:07:44
That's that's. 02:07:46
And so we have to and so if we approve it. 02:07:48
Which I'm not inclined to approve it right now. I'm more inclined to approve some fill. 02:07:51
That's capped. 02:07:57
So that the flooding can get mitigated. 02:08:00
The current flooding can get mitigated on the on basically on the front specifically for. 02:08:04
Miss Muellers lot. 02:08:09
But that's. 02:08:11
Yeah, Miss Miller's 10/10. 02:08:13
That's the little, the little historic. She can't move it. She can't. 02:08:15
Raise it. She can't do anything with it. We may be able to raise it, but with it being on the National Register, you are extremely 02:08:18
limited on what you. 02:08:23
Are allowed to do, yeah. 02:08:28
And plus the size of that how it's, it's a historic cottage and you couldn't raise it up to we do permit elevation of historic 02:08:29
properties. We do allow for the elevation of historic properties to protect them from flood. 02:08:36
Yeah. 02:08:44
Also, I think it's important to note that. 02:08:46
The town is very close to completion of their resiliency. 02:08:50
And sea level rise adaptation plan which will be complete with strategies to address. 02:08:55
Problems that are currently before this board. 02:09:00
And that is supposed to be going to the council for a vote for final approval in July. 02:09:04
I don't understand what that means. Something that is going to fix this? 02:09:10
Something to. 02:09:14
Give. 02:09:16
Owners a playbook of strategies that the town will hope to change ordinances in order to. 02:09:17
Improve the opportunities for people to address problems like that. 02:09:25
Yes. 02:09:29
I have a question for you, I'm sorry. 02:09:30
Want to interrupt for a second? 02:09:33
If we were not. 02:09:34
To approve this today. 02:09:37
And it turns out that. 02:09:40
Raising the street level. 02:09:43
Significantly impacts these lots. 02:09:45
Would it be a bar for them to reapply? 02:09:47
Based on. 02:09:52
The actual impact of raising the. 02:09:53
The streets. 02:09:56
The street in front. 02:09:58
They couldn't come back with the exact same request. 02:10:00
They what They would not be able to come back with the exact same request if they were denied. 02:10:04
But a? 02:10:09
Variation of this request, but that seems to put them in the position of. 02:10:11
US saying. 02:10:16
You can't. 02:10:18
Do what you want to do because the. 02:10:19
Increase in the level of the street is likely not to impact you. 02:10:23
And then increasing the level of this. 02:10:26
Of this street. 02:10:30
Pretty clearly to me, indicates that's going to. 02:10:32
Add water to that lot. 02:10:35
It may not add the footprint of the water. 02:10:37
But if you raise this street, what is how many feet? 02:10:40
2 or 1 1/2 feet? How many? 02:10:44
1 1/2 feet, so 1 1/2 feet. And does that go into the right of way as well or just the? 02:10:47
The street itself. What do you do with the right away when you raise the street like that? 02:10:52
The sorry, I thought that before. 02:10:56
The right away would be regraded. 02:10:59
Yeah, to blend with the the new elevation of the roadway. 02:11:02
And large pipes are proposed underneath the driveways. 02:11:06
And there's a there's a large. 02:11:10
Check Valve. 02:11:13
Proposed on the corner of 10/10. 02:11:15
That would prevent. 02:11:17
Water, uh. 02:11:18
From getting up. 02:11:20
That drainage ditch? 02:11:21
But the the flooding, the elevation based flooding would still occur from the back of the property. Yeah, raising the street is 02:11:23
not going to. 02:11:27
Increase the flooding. It's the tidal flooding. 02:11:32
For that one, because we can't raise the street and inundate somebody'd. 02:11:35
We have to have our own. 02:11:39
Stormwater mitigation if we're going to raise the street so. 02:11:42
Yes, hers is from Tidal, definitely. 02:11:46
If I could offer a couple of points. 02:11:49
We the changes that were made to this plan. 02:11:52
In the last go round where after meeting with the resiliency team. 02:11:56
The reason the wall was moved back three feet was. 02:12:00
Doctor Elko, who was, he's on the resiliency team, said that that was. 02:12:05
One of the things that she thought would help. 02:12:09
The reason that the wall stops where it is on the right hand side of the property is because. 02:12:11
They told us that one of the things they were going to propose was that you were allowed to do things within that 30 foot OCR in 02:12:17
set back, which is why that wall stops at 30 feet. 02:12:21
Because we were told that. 02:12:26
That's what is going to be put forward to town now. The town hasn't accepted it yet, but that's. 02:12:29
That was the direction they were going. 02:12:33
That was why this plan was done. 02:12:36
In kind of coordination with the resiliency team. 02:12:40
Umm. 02:12:44
And one of the things that came up with the drainage. 02:12:46
In the future. 02:12:51
Is that by raising the grade? 02:12:53
The pipes that have to be put in for drain for draining. 02:12:56
The way it is currently have to be so deep that they're almost rendered ineffective without having some type of an additional pump 02:13:01
system. 02:13:05
So by doing this great, assuming everybody on on that that. 02:13:10
I think it's Sea Breeze Lane. Everything on the southern side of Sea Breeze Lane were to do the same. 02:13:14
That would actually help with the drainage infrastructure in the future. 02:13:19
And to your point about not wanting to approve grade over a certain over 1 foot or whatever. 02:13:24
What if we set that by the grade? 02:13:32
So it's not necessarily 1 foot 2 foot. What if it's you can grade up to? 02:13:35
6 foot 5 or up to whatever. 02:13:41
You all think is best and in that way the people that already have higher properties. 02:13:44
You know they're not going to need to bring in as much fill. 02:13:48
If their elevation is at 6 foot and not. 02:13:51
You know, 4 1/2 year or whatever. I don't know if that's a potential. 02:13:55
Middle ground kind of a thing, not the way the. 02:14:00
The zoning ordinances set out right now for our approval, who is the resiliency team because I don't think it's staff. Staff has 02:14:03
not seen this. 02:14:09
Because you've referenced them a couple of times, but I I know. 02:14:18
It's Kim. 02:14:21
Something Stafford and Brown Is it the consultants? The consultants? 02:14:24
But it's not the staff, the staff. 02:14:28
I mean, we did meet with the staff and go over the plan. 02:14:31
That's not that we're talking about the. 02:14:34
Consultants, don't you think? 02:14:37
I mean. 02:14:41
Not here to give you advice, certainly, but. 02:14:42
Don't you think it would be a safer play to? 02:14:45
Postpone your. 02:14:48
Application until you find out what the resilience committee. 02:14:49
Is going to do and what you and you know whether or not the. 02:14:53
The streets going to be raised and what the impacts are going to have. 02:14:58
Rather than have us. 02:15:02
Vote, vote on this and have you barred. 02:15:06
From doing the exact same plan even if it becomes feasible in the future. So we did talk about that. 02:15:09
We feel, we feel pretty confident based on the communication between Semen Whiteside and the resilience and team, that what we're 02:15:18
doing is going to fall in the parameters of what they're going to present. 02:15:22
We're faced with the dilemma of we're under construction right now. We have the ability to come in and do all of this work now and 02:15:28
be proactive. 02:15:32
Planning for the future? 02:15:37
As opposed to. 02:15:39
You know, if we have to come in and raise this grade, then all the landscaping, all the drainage, the hardscape, all of that stuff 02:15:41
that would be done. 02:15:45
Would essentially have to be taken out and redone. 02:15:50
Which is a, you know, substantial cost to the homeowner at that point to basically redo. 02:15:53
You know, as far as we are concerned. 02:15:57
This is what Sullivan's Island is going to do. This is what the town is telling us they're going to do. 02:16:01
With this with this master plan. 02:16:05
Now the the the timeline and all that stuff, I understand that is up in the air. We don't know. 02:16:08
But. 02:16:12
If this happens in two years. 02:16:13
We did this work now. 02:16:16
Knowing that this was going to happen. 02:16:18
And then it's a substantial. 02:16:21
You know, for Mr. Abbasold and the homeowners at that point. 02:16:24
Are you really making this application because of what's going to happen in the future with the town or are you making this 02:16:27
application because what's going on right now? It was both. 02:16:32
To be honest, it was. 02:16:37
Mostly to do what was happening now, but done to work with what the town will do in the future. 02:16:40
Well, do you have any evidence of what the town is going to do in the future is going to negatively impact? 02:16:47
Because what I've heard is it's not. 02:16:52
I mean this the semen whitesides own master plan says that. 02:16:54
You have that the town needs to allow. 02:16:58
These property owners to address their properties because they're not. 02:17:01
It's not addressed inside of their plan. I mean, no, no, no. I get that part. What I what? 02:17:05
What? I don't know that matters, but. 02:17:10
These folks are saying what we're going to do is not going to impact your life. It's not going to get better. 02:17:14
It's not going to negatively, it's not gonna make it worse. 02:17:18
And y'all aren't saying what? You don't have evidence that what the town's gonna do is gonna make it worse. You're just saying 02:17:21
it's not gonna help. 02:17:24
Right. 02:17:27
Yeah, yeah, flooding the worst. 02:17:30
Regardless of what they do. 02:17:31
Well, I would also counter that the town is protecting everybody but these 14 property owners by that. 02:17:33
When you look at that, you also when you look at the plan and you look at the protection that Raising Osceola gives all the other 02:17:39
property owners. 02:17:42
They're all being taken care of, but by virtue of us being on the Marsh side of Osceola, these 14 property owners are excluded. 02:17:45
From that. 02:17:52
What stage of construction are you currently in on 2/18? 02:17:54
10/18. 02:17:58
We are final. I mean it's the BZA were to grant approval, the surveyor would be there next week staking out so that we could get 02:17:59
started. 02:18:04
We are currently scheduled to be completed in September. 02:18:09
Do you need this landscaping? 02:18:17
I probably should know this, but even if the landscaping plan or whatever you're going to do has to be approved for you get see 02:18:20
it. 02:18:23
Yes, before we start doing it, we need to get town's blessing on it. 02:18:25
We were trying to. 02:18:30
Get this so that we could do that. 02:18:31
I'm just struggling a little bit to meet the requirements. 02:18:40
That we have to meet to grant variance is. 02:18:44
That you really can't use the property. 02:18:47
The way you want to. You know you can't. 02:18:50
Make real use of the property. 02:18:53
And it sounds like what's the size of the structure you're building on the on 10/18? 02:18:55
How many square feet? 02:19:00
Oh, it's 4200 and change heated square feet. I think that doesn't seem like that's a real restriction on your. 02:19:02
Use of the. 02:19:09
Of the property. To counter that, you can't even get to the property. 02:19:10
And why are you building there? 02:19:13
A Literally. 02:19:15
Walking and driving through the 12 inch of water on the driveway at hot. 02:19:17
I mean I I I have to wear my big boots because if I wear my regular boat shoes the water is over top of it. 02:19:22
On at hot tubs, not every day. 02:19:28
I'm on my 4th temporary power pole because the at high tides the water is so high it floods my temporary power pole at that front 02:19:31
right corner over 2 feet. 02:19:35
Part of this is if this is a plan approved. 02:19:42
Dominion needs to raise the transformer that is at that corner of the property because it has flooded so many times. 02:19:44
That the internals of it have been corroded. 02:19:52
I'm continually having problems just keeping power on the House because of that. 02:19:56
Have you looked at damage to the marsh as a result of the wall? 02:20:02
Have you investigated that there's been? 02:20:06
Statements that it's going to damage the. 02:20:09
I guess the way you deal with the runoff is going to damage the marsh like y'all looked into that. 02:20:12
I mean, I would assume RCA would make you do that. 02:20:17
I would part of the reason that the resiliency team. 02:20:20
Is proposing the the landscape or I'm sorry, the living living shoreline was what they called it. 02:20:26
The reason that that was being proposed, and I'll have to let Kevin talk to the science aspect of it, was that the assumption was 02:20:32
that that that helped prevent that from the way of action. 02:20:37
I I think the marsh is going to do what the marsh is going to do. You know, you can't fight back the ocean. 02:20:44
You can protect yourself as much as you can, but. 02:20:50
This is at an extreme. 02:20:54
Flood event? You know all bets are off, right? 02:20:58
But this isn't about the extreme, this is about the. 02:21:01
The typical. 02:21:04
You know, umm. 02:21:06
More than a dozen times a year, that. 02:21:07
You are, you're on and out. Your house is on an island and that's what happens with with Mary's property. Are you saying you get 02:21:10
title? 02:21:14
Flooding in the front of the lot. 02:21:17
Every single time there's a hot tide. 02:21:20
It wraps the property. 02:21:23
It gets on the Kilpatrick's property and part of the problem is it gets there and it gets stuck. 02:21:25
So we actually have already at the beginning of construction it was such a problem. 02:21:29
We regraded the front of our property and the front of 10/10. 02:21:34
To allow the water to get out because it would get into the front of. 02:21:38
1018 Osceola and it was trash. 02:21:42
This was an existing condition when. 02:21:55
The house was. 02:21:58
Torn down and a replacement house was built. 02:22:00
That was obviously an existing condition. 02:22:03
Of this lot. So we're just getting this now. 02:22:06
When the house is. 02:22:10
Being built. 02:22:12
I have a problem with that. 02:22:14
Umm. 02:22:17
You, I mean, you're not you, you, you got, you must have gotten some. Go back to that. 02:22:22
DRB must have granted you some. 02:22:30
Because the house isn't some of the does have. 02:22:34
This incursion into some of the setbacks. So it's a very large house. That is actually not what we built though. 02:22:38
We did not use that variance because. 02:22:45
So this isn't even existing. Well. Well, we did not take advantage of the variance that we were granted for the sod set back to 02:22:49
get into the set back. But but you moved the house over to accommodate the neighbors. 02:22:55
Got it. But you still are building, what would you say 4600 square foot house? 02:23:00
On a lot that floods. 02:23:05
It was an existing condition. 02:23:08
That you should have asked for mitigation at the beginning, not and you're asking for it at the end and so. 02:23:10
We feel a little. 02:23:15
Constrained. 02:23:18
You might say. 02:23:19
At least I do. 02:23:24
Charles, can I ask you a question, do you think? 02:23:26
The resiliency. 02:23:28
Committee or report? 02:23:31
Will say something smart to you, like when I look at the. 02:23:33
Cross section of the. 02:23:36
Of what's proposed as a landscape wall. 02:23:38
I'm an architect by nature and you know the concrete section to do that. 02:23:44
And to have it withstand. 02:23:49
What it has to withstand? 02:23:52
There's a pretty big impact and I don't think it's. 02:23:55
Pressure treated. 02:23:57
6 by sixes. 02:23:59
Either and it leaves. 02:24:00
US in a really bad place because we don't know what we're approving. 02:24:03
You know there's no. 02:24:06
So so we have we have an option. 02:24:09
That we can do. We actually did this at the last meeting. 02:24:11
We do have an option of tabling this. 02:24:15
And asking you. 02:24:18
To go back and do a deeper dive, not with the resiliency team, but with our actual town staff. 02:24:20
Our resiliency officer and our zoning administrator and our building inspector and that is really what I would like to see. 02:24:26
Especially. 02:24:33
Because we're going to be having some things go before town council. 02:24:34
That might even mitigate y'all even having to come to us. 02:24:39
I don't know. 02:24:42
I mean, you say you're going to finish in September. 02:24:43
I don't think another month. 02:24:46
Would limit you that much. I'm sorry that you've waited until the end of the project. 02:24:50
But I really feel that our town staff, who are our own experts. 02:24:55
Need to look at this because. 02:25:00
They have not recommended approval of this based on what they've seen. You've worked with the resiliency team. That's not our 02:25:02
staff. 02:25:06
And as far as the BCA? 02:25:10
Our due diligence is listening not only to you. 02:25:13
And to your engineers, but. 02:25:16
To our staff who deal with these issues all the time. 02:25:18
So that's actually. 02:25:22
My preference as to what we would do. 02:25:25
We I don't want to deny you. 02:25:29
But based on the information before me. 02:25:31
I have no other choice. 02:25:34
Based on exactly what you're asking for, or I would have to put so many contingencies on it. 02:25:35
That it would be unusable to you. 02:25:40
We want you to be able to mitigate. 02:25:42
Flooding. 02:25:46
Umm, we're not in the business of approving. We have never. 02:25:48
Approved a seawall. 02:25:53
We will be setting a precedent that we would have to make sure that we were not setting a precedent. 02:25:54
The fill I get. 02:25:59
But I really would prefer. 02:26:02
Tabling it. 02:26:05
If you're, I mean. 02:26:07
You don't get a vote on what we do. 02:26:09
You know, if we table it, it's not because we don't want you to be able to protect these two properties. 02:26:13
It's because we want our town staff to be able to look at it and work with you, not just a resiliency team. 02:26:18
That are the town's consultants who haven't received approval of their work. 02:26:25
By the town council. 02:26:29
Obviously we would prefer that over denial. 02:26:33
Yeah. Oh, I don't want to deny you at all. 02:26:36
Just just for clarification, we have met with Charles and Max. We did not meet with, I'm sorry, I don't know your name, the towns 02:26:39
resiliency Rebecca. 02:26:43
She's in charge of all of our plants and trees. So we have, she's a very important person for this one. You know, we, we met. 02:26:48
With Max and Charles. 02:26:56
The architect and I have. 02:26:58
I know that Semen Whiteside has had some discussion with them. I don't want to make it seem like we didn't include them at all. 02:27:00
Also, it was my impression that in the packet it called that out as a wood wall. If not, that is an error on us that we can we can 02:27:06
correct. But it is you know what, you know what it says in your application? A fence made of materials other than wood or metal. 02:27:14
An offense without any openings across its plane. 02:27:24
Reference the variance. 02:27:27
OK, I have a question too. How many? 02:27:33
Days or. 02:27:36
What does the tide have to reach to make it so that? 02:27:38
It is impassable for you to. 02:27:43
Reach the property. 02:27:45
I would say anytime the tide is over. 02:27:50
I don't know how it's Dean too. We think five and a half, six feet. It's probably up in. 02:27:54
See if it's if it's. If it ties at 6 1/2, the Todd is over our slab. 02:27:59
So it's not, it's not a 6 1/2 foot tide washes over the entire thing. 02:28:04
If it is. 02:28:09
The road is at 4.5 and change so if it's a 5 foot tide. 02:28:11
You have 6 inches of you have more than 6 inches of water because our driveway is less than that. 02:28:17
Umm, so I would say. 02:28:21
I would say A5 foot tide makes it makes it so. 02:28:24
Anything greater than that? 02:28:29
It comes up at 6 1/2. 02:28:31
You know you're from. 02:28:33
From when I tore down the house. 02:28:35
To October in 2023, I had five storm events that had water. 02:28:37
Across the property I had photos where you can't even see the land. 02:28:44
From the storms, so when you get the bigger. 02:28:47
Fall hurricanes and storms. 02:28:50
You know, again, you're not going to stop that and prevent that. 02:28:53
But on the normal high tides when you get a six foot tide or a 6 1/2 foot tide. 02:28:56
The the driveway area at the front where it backs up is underwater. 02:29:01
Would it be helpful? 02:29:11
It's more information. 02:29:13
Sure. Yeah. I have a question. When you say that the Osceola side of the property is inaccessible, is that because the ditch is 02:29:20
backing up with water? 02:29:25
From the tide. 02:29:31
From the tide and isn't it true that. 02:29:32
One of the minor improvement projects that's that the town is currently already pursuing through the skip grant funding will be. 02:29:34
Check Valve. 02:29:42
At the outlet of that, ditch that. 02:29:44
Allow it not to fill with tidal water. 02:29:47
I don't know, but I would assume so, yes. 02:29:50
But I would counter that by saying that if you don't raise the grade around that, it doesn't do any good because it's going to 02:29:52
come right around it. 02:29:56
Right, and the ditch is lower than the yard, isn't it? Yes, it's a ditch. The ditch in front of 10/10 basically just stays full of 02:29:59
water. 02:30:03
It does flow and when the tide comes in it backs up in front of 10/18 goes up. 02:30:10
Right, and these are semen and whitesides stormwater plan improvements, right? You separated out the raising of the road from. 02:30:14
The check valve on the outlet. 02:30:21
Of that drainage pipe. 02:30:26
And then I feel like I'm missing one other sort of minor improvement to that system that would happen on a much quicker timeline 02:30:28
and mitigate a lot of the flooding around in that neighborhood. 02:30:34
And at a much quicker timeframe than raising the road at Osceola. Is that what you recall from the stormwater plan? 02:30:40
For you guys in the normal course of business. 02:30:51
Discussion at the office in order to you do gain some more information. 02:30:59
Then we can come back and we reserve. 02:31:03
Exactly. 02:31:05
And when do you expect to have the resilience? 02:31:08
I just love that the resilience committee it sounds. 02:31:13
Anyway, when is the resilience? 02:31:16
Consultant, their committee going to come back. 02:31:19
Recommendations. Are there options? Do you know that? 02:31:22
It's the third Tuesday of July will be when it's presented to council. 02:31:25
For the final draft is presented to Council cumulatively, don't you think it would be helpful? 02:31:31
Contract for the property owners to the city, our town. 02:31:39
To have that information to see if they can problem solve. 02:31:43
Yes. And we met with the resilience. 02:31:46
Consultants on Tuesday of this week to discuss. 02:31:50
What the recommendations might be? What? 02:31:54
For ordinance amendments that. 02:31:57
Will address these. 02:32:00
You know, low elevation lots and the concerns for them. 02:32:03
And are working through. 02:32:07
But have not completed. 02:32:09
The study that we need to do in order to. 02:32:12
Provide those recommendations for ordinance changes and we're working with the Planning Commission currently kind of prepping them 02:32:14
for. 02:32:17
What's to come on that front? OK, And would have a better understanding of what? 02:32:21
We might be able to do with these two locks. 02:32:25
Correct there. It may be that there. 02:32:29
Be a requirement for a variance. 02:32:32
A design that's very similar to this. 02:32:35
James Yeah, I'd like to make a lecture that we. 02:32:39
Table the variance requests for 10/10 oscillator. 02:32:42
On the other island in 1018, Osceola Ave. 02:32:47
To give. 02:32:50
The amount of time to have further discussions with the town. 02:32:52
And then? 02:32:56
Bring it back in July, probably. 02:32:59
Probably been. 02:33:03
That's OK, They can still bring it back. In July we will have. 02:33:04
My the the most. 02:33:08
Important thing. 02:33:10
Is and I second that. 02:33:11
The most important thing is for the three of you. 02:33:13
To be able to sit down with their team. 02:33:17
Rebecca knows what we're actually doing. 02:33:20
And what, what might impact but. 02:33:23
I need y'all's eyes on this. 02:33:26
We need your eyes on this project and more. 02:33:28
Specific. 02:33:31
I I'm sorry that we have to consider tabling this. We're going to vote on it in a minute. 02:33:32
But. 02:33:38
We feel like we're getting it at the last minute. 02:33:39
And the variances that are being requested. 02:33:43
Are quite substantial. 02:33:46
And. 02:33:48
Way out of the ordinary. 02:33:50
So that's why. 02:33:51
It's our due diligence to make sure we're making the best decision, and we don't have enough information to do that. 02:33:53
So I will call for a vote on favor of tabling all in favor of the motion to table. Please signify by saying aye aye. 02:33:59
No opposition this and when I I did have. 02:34:08
A question before Oh, OK, before I vote. 02:34:14
Do you think July is really enough time as opposed to August? 02:34:18
That's fine. No? Plenty of time. 02:34:21
The last one was tabled and brought back in a month, I know, but we didn't have an intervening council vote that well, no, no, I 02:34:24
don't think we need, I don't think we need a council vote. What I'm really more concerned about is that. 02:34:30
Our resiliency officer has the ability to look at this. 02:34:37
In the context of what is actually happening, because evidently things are happening. 02:34:41
And I said I thought August 2, but Rebecca. 02:34:47
Said I could have some discussion. 02:34:51
Fruitful discussions between male and July, Yeah. 02:34:53
They know what they know what they're working on. They just had a meeting this week, so. 02:34:56
OK. Can your vote stay? Yeah. OK. 02:35:01
I didn't say anything, OK, but yes, now. 02:35:04
So that approved, it is tabled and we'll come back in July and now we have one more. 02:35:06
Excuse me, Yes. 02:35:12
Yes, I'm. 02:35:14
1026 off yellow on the other side of the Yes Sir. 02:35:16
Waiting here for a while. Glad you tangled it and I wondered if I could just say a couple. 02:35:21
It's related. 02:35:27
To moving forward. 02:35:29
Yes. Can you keep it very short and you need to go to the microphone. We have a member that's on a short break, just requested a 02:35:32
short break. So he's OK. Well, I'm going to let him talk while he's not here. 02:35:38
All right. My name is Dean Kilpatrick. I've lived at 1026 Osceola. 02:35:43
For 50 years. 02:35:48
And have seen the tides rise and the flooding and all of that. 02:35:50
I do think that the. 02:35:55
Those houses, the three houses that are adjacent. 02:35:57
Really do need some help. And it's not, you know, if you've got huge tidal flooding, that's one thing. 02:36:02
But I mean, just regular rain coming off. And if you raise Osceola, something needs to be done. 02:36:08
So we're supportive of most of what they want to do. We would just like to be included in discussions. 02:36:14
So because really, you know, if you raise the grade more on that lot. 02:36:20
The water goes someplace, and if you raise the street, the water goes someplace. 02:36:26
So we would like to work together to get a common solution for it, but it really is a problem. Yes, as part of any. 02:36:32
Agreement to add fill to a lot they have to provide drainage program drainage plans so that it would not they have they have 02:36:41
reached out on that which I want to you know give them credit for and our house is. 02:36:48
Actually, not on the historic register, but we want to talk about it being because it was there in 1890. 02:36:55
So at any rate, we just want to work together. So thank you. 02:37:02
OK. 02:37:06
I think we're at the end. 02:37:10
Oh my God. 02:37:12
OK, we have an special exception request. Historic Accessory Dwelling Unit, 1914 Central Ave. 02:37:14
Approval of special exception for the historic structure on the property to be used in accessory dwelling unit in accordance with 02:37:22
Zoning Ordinance Sections 2120, C 2. 02:37:26
And 21178 Charles please present for the town. 02:37:30
Thank you. I'm so sorry. 02:37:33
That you had to sit through this entire meeting. 02:37:35
I'm sure Amber was riveted the entire time. 02:37:38
So yes, this is a 1914 Central Ave. The request is for the special exception to allow the historic. 02:37:43
Cottage on the lot to remain and become an accessory dwelling unit with a new home to be built also in another location on the 02:37:51
lot. 02:37:55
This is the property outlined in yellow and a couple of photographs of the. 02:38:01
Existing college. 02:38:05
Here's an aerial of the property. 02:38:08
And then a posting on the property advertising the meeting tonight. 02:38:11
And. 02:38:15
For the record, this was. 02:38:17
Added to our historic registry. 02:38:18
In April. 02:38:22
In the in the last couple of months. 02:38:26
And it had been previously recommended in the 2007 Snyder survey, but not. 02:38:30
Formally designated. 02:38:37
And so we're happy to have this. 02:38:39
Little Cottage added to our historic designation list. You can see from the. 02:38:42
Christina Butler report that was presented to the Design Review Board when it was. 02:38:48
Designated historic, this was the original the form of it in the. 02:38:54
1930. 02:39:00
8 uh. 02:39:02
Sanborn. 02:39:05
Probably wrong on that date and I apologize but. 02:39:07
Early Sanborn map shows it. 02:39:10
With a little front porch. 02:39:13
Rectangular body with a little. 02:39:15
Appendage off to the side and so. 02:39:17
Overtime there's been a porch added to the side. The front porch has been removed in an entry entry stairway. 02:39:20
Added there and then there was some expansion on the back to have these. 02:39:28
Several rooms. 02:39:32
So the proposal is to bring it back to this. 02:39:34
Size, which is under 1200 square feet, meeting the requirements of the special exception. 02:39:37
And. 02:39:46
Per the board's request, we have a. 02:39:47
Formal site plan for the proposal. So this is the existing site plan on the property. 02:39:51
With a non historic shed in the rear. 02:39:57
The proposed. 02:40:00
Redesigned cottage would not be elevated or moved from its current location. 02:40:02
A new pool would separate it from the new construction that would fit within the setbacks of the property. 02:40:08
As required by the special exception. 02:40:15
Rules. 02:40:18
Just a little background, it was March 19th. 02:40:20
And the board gave conceptual approval. 02:40:23
For removing the non historic conditions and. 02:40:26
Prove the structures of traditional island resource. 02:40:29
Again, that would return the cottage to under 1200 square feet, making it eligible for this special exception under section 02:40:33
21C2120C2 of the zoning ordinance. 02:40:38
That was the 38th Sanborn map. The current college square footage is 1479. 02:40:45
With the removals of the non historic additions it will be 1183 square feet. 02:40:51
And the new construction is proposed to mostly be a one story elevated home. 02:40:57
On the rear of the property, with small yard and pool separating it from the historic cottage. 02:41:03
Staff recommends approval of the special exception according to DRB approval and provided that the Board makes findings of fact 02:41:09
that the project complies with the standards for granting special exceptions found in section 21178. 02:41:16
Those findings of fact need to be that there is adequate provision made for such items as setbacks, fences. 02:41:23
And buffered planting strips to protect adjacent properties from possible adverse influence of the proposed use. 02:41:30
Such as noise, vibration, dust, glare, odor, traffic congestion, and similar factors. 02:41:36
Really, this meets the setback requirements and. 02:41:43
Is a single family use in a single family district so. 02:41:48
Most of that is. 02:41:52
Not particularly germane. 02:41:53
Vehicular traffic and pedestrian movement on adjacent roads will not be hindered or endangered. 02:41:57
They'll use the same access point. 02:42:04
From Central. 02:42:08
From Central Ave. that is currently used for the. 02:42:09
Historic Cottage. 02:42:13
That that road would be extended so that off street parking and loading areas and entrances and negatives of these areas are 02:42:15
adequate in terms of location, amount, design and construction to serve the proposed use. 02:42:21
So the driver would be extended to serve both of the homes. 02:42:27
The proposed use should be compatible with the existing uses to the extent. 02:42:31
That such use will not adversely affect the level of property values, general character or general welfare of the nearby area. 02:42:36
Again, they're just proposing to place a new home in the backyard. 02:42:44
Fairly large lot. 02:42:49
So it's also. 02:42:55
Important to note that. 02:42:58
There's ownership requirement for these special exceptions, so it must remain at a 4% tax. 02:43:00
With the Charleston County. 02:43:09
Assessor's Office. 02:43:11
Meaning that there's owner occupied in one of the units. 02:43:13
And. 02:43:17
Other considerations of the structure being under 1200 have been met. 02:43:19
That I'll ask if you all have any questions or turn it over to the applicant. 02:43:25
Nope. 02:43:30
Would you like to have? 02:43:32
Present. 02:43:34
Charles, am I able to drive or will I just? 02:43:37
Yes, Oh no. And I'll ask you to advance us to some slides. 02:43:41
I gotcha. So my name is Amber Ahmed and I prepared the submittal. I drew the renovation to the cottage as well as the proposed 02:43:45
primary structure in the back. 02:43:51
If you'll take us to C1 or C2. 02:43:58
Here we are so just reiterating what Charles told you. We found the evidence from the Sanborn map. 02:44:03
That the original form of the cottage was just a simple Gable with a full width front porch. 02:44:10
And it always had the little appendage on the rear left corner. 02:44:16
So we had Christina Butler, historic preservationist. 02:44:22
In town, prepare. 02:44:26
A historic report for us as well and her found her findings rather. 02:44:29
Corroborated that Sanborn. 02:44:34
Footprint in terms of? 02:44:37
Historic form and materials. So we took that to the DRB. They approved. 02:44:39
The cottage to be. 02:44:45
Added to the historic inventory on the island. 02:44:47
Such that we removed all. 02:44:51
All of the extraneous additions that have been added over time will you take us to? 02:44:53
A or the. 02:45:00
Demo plan. 02:45:01
So you can see what would be removed. 02:45:04
Additionally, there are two water oaks. 02:45:09
A pecan and a Birch that is going in front of the tree Commission. 02:45:12
To make way for the proposed primary structure in the back. 02:45:16
And if you'll take us to the next slide. 02:45:20
Yeah, this is a nicely treed lot too. So the is going to be completely hidden. That's exactly right. In fact, to your point, if 02:45:24
you'll take us back to the contextual images in the front. 02:45:29
This is so nicely nestled. You can see there central. I mean it is veiled from the streetscape. 02:45:37
So it will it will be difficult to see a larger structure looming behind it. 02:45:45
And so. 02:45:52
You know we just tried to play within all the parameters of the special exception. 02:45:54
The cottage meets all the requirements and then the primary structure. 02:45:59
Would meet all of the ordinances as well, so. 02:46:04
OK. 02:46:08
Don't have any questions. 02:46:10
OK. Thanks for giving us an easy one. 02:46:13
We should have slipped it in the middle. Maybe. Maybe we should have. 02:46:18
OK. 02:46:27
All righty. Well, I have I have absolutely no questions. I love. 02:46:29
I do love the special exception even though. 02:46:34
Because it does preserve. I grew up on this island and it does preserve all the. 02:46:38
Small colleges. 02:46:43
That give the eclectic feel they've always been small cottages and big houses on this island. 02:46:44
So I just. 02:46:50
I really like your plan. I do know you have to go to the tree Commission but. 02:46:51
But you have plenty of other trees on this property, so. 02:46:56
I don't think I don't think that's going to be a problem. 02:46:59
Maybe I shouldn't say that. 02:47:02
But but yeah, I really. 02:47:04
I love the. 02:47:08
Of the design. 02:47:10
Yeah. 02:47:11
Make a motion. Yes, you may make a motion. 02:47:14
I don't think we have to discuss this. 02:47:16
Unless our architect has something to say. 02:47:18
Yeah, it's yeah, yeah. 02:47:21
All right, I'll make a motion that we grant the applicants request. 02:47:24
For approval of a special exception for the historic structure. 02:47:28
On the property to be used as an accessory dwelling unit. 02:47:32
In accordance with the zoning ordinance. 02:47:36
21-20C. 02:47:40
Open paren to close paren. 02:47:42
And 21-17. 02:47:45
Eight in that. 02:47:48
So let's see, we found that there's adequate provision made. 02:47:50
For items such as setbacks, fences. 02:47:54
And buffered or planting strips to protect. 02:47:58
Adjacent properties from. 02:48:01
Possible adverse influence. 02:48:02
Of the proposed use, such as noise, vibration, dust, glare, odor, traffic congestion, and similar factors #2 vehicular traffic and 02:48:04
pedestrian movement on adjacent roads shall not be hindered or. 02:48:11
Endangered 3 off street parking and loading areas and the entrance and exits. 02:48:17
Of these areas will be adequate in terms of location, amount, design and construction to serve the. 02:48:22
Proposed use. 02:48:29
The use, it appears based on the evidence, will be compatible with existing uses to the extent that such use will not adversely 02:48:31
affect both. 02:48:35
Level of property values, general character or general? 02:48:40
Welfare of nearby area. 02:48:43
Is there a second second? 02:48:46
All in favor signify by saying aye aye, like sign opposed. The special exception is granted. 02:48:48
And. 02:48:54
This meeting is adjourned. 02:48:56
Get out of here. 02:48:58
It's not our longest. 02:49:00
But it's. 02:49:02
Pretty close, good to see you. 02:49:03
Yeah. 02:49:06
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